Canadian Airgun Forum

The #1 Community for Airguns in Canada!
It is currently Fri Dec 19, 2014 4:34 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours


 

The Canadian Airgun Forums are a place for people to discuss and learn about airguns and the airgunning sport in Canada. There are lots of discussions about airguns, airgun accessories, reviews, modification and repair information, airgun events, field target and free classifieds!

 

You need to register before you can post: click the register link to proceed. Before you register, please read the forum rules. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload your own pictures, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple, and absolutely free! To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.







Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 28 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:00 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2008 8:38 am
Posts: 109
Location: Near Waterloo, Ontario
Hey guys, I am looking for opinions on these 2 pistols (others may be considered also). I have the urge to get an air pistol... No real reason why, but I want one. I have a 2240 but I want one that isn't CO2.
I haven't shot either of these but my back ground is in standard pistol so I have a bit of a clue. I don't want to break the bank. I am also a machinist so I am sure I can mount a scope if I want on either of these guns.

What do you think?
Do you own either of these?
What is the speed like on these 2?
What is the accuracy like?
How is the ease of loading on them?


Any other details would be great.

Chris

_________________
araz2114

live each day as if it were your last...learn as if you would live forever

Carbon Express arrows The Bow Shop, Waterloo. http://www.bow-shop.com


Top
 Profile  
 
Top
 
PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 2:45 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2005 7:22 pm
Posts: 926
Location: Mississauga On. Ca.
Hi Chris,

I have the IZH46m with a Bushnell red dot on board. I also have an HW40pca with a 2 power pistol scope. There is supposed to be a Pistol FT shoot being arranged for February. Come out to the Pistol FT and you can use the HW and try the IZH. There would probable be the opportunity to try several other worthy products at the same time.

Ted

_________________
Airgunning is my hobby... and it is cheaper than
maintaining an outside relationship with another woman.
-------------------------------------------------------
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2010 1:12 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Sep 09, 2009 3:19 pm
Posts: 60
I have the IHZ46M and a 1322. Love the trigger and accuracy of the 46M...and it is easy to load, no pumping. The 46M is a great buy...love it

_________________
IZH 46M
1322
Air Arms Pro Sport .177 with walnut stock with Bushnell Legend 5-15-40
Air Arms S400 MPR with Elite 6500
Hammerli AP40


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2010 1:30 pm 
Offline
Site Moderator

Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2005 9:25 am
Posts: 3067
Location: Ontario, Canada
What do you think?
The IZH-46M is definitely a more costly and better pistol.

Do you own either of these?
I had the IZH-46 and a couple of Daisy 717 pistols. I also tinkered with a Daisy 777.

What is the speed like on these 2?
The Daisy 717 pistols were similar to the HW40 in power. Light weight pellets such as the Hobby or Geco do around 400-405fps while moderate weight pellets (7.9-8.4gr) do around 370-375fps. My IZH-46 was a non-M model and did about the same as the 717. The IZH-46M does well into the 400s.

What is the accuracy like?
Accuracy should be very close.

How is the ease of loading on them?
Both are easy to load. The Daisy has a bolt action and the IZH loads directly into the barrel after the transfer port is flipped up.

Any other details would be great.
- The Daisy has plastic grip panels. The IZH has an oversized wooden grip that can be custom shaped to your liking.
- The Daisy frame is made of pot metal. The IZH is steel.
- The rear sight on the IZH is better.
- The loading bolt on the Daisy is plastic. The IZH loading lever and transfer port are steel.

Cheers,
Todd


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2010 4:44 pm 
Online
Site sponsor and moderator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 2:40 pm
Posts: 5894
Location: Eastern Passage . Nova Scotia
What do you think ?
I did not like the grip for 2 hands shooting on my Gamo Compact so I re-did it .
This pistol is very dependable .
The trigger is better then my Beeman P17 & HW45 .
My Compact has no rail for optic .
Image

What is the speed like ?
My Compact gets around 360 fps with Crosman Wadcutter from CanadianTire.

What is the accuracy like ?
My Compact is just a little more accurate then my P17 .
The front of the gun does not jump as much as my P17 .

How is the ease of loading on them ?
It is easy to load, just put the pellet in the barrel once it is open .
My Compact is a littte easier to close then my P17



In this link there is some reading about the Gamo Compact & the Baikal IZH46 .
http://blogsearch.google.com/blogsearch ... com%2Fblog

Here is the drop of a Crosman Wadcutter 7.9 gr going at 360 fps
according to Chairgun2
Image

_________________
René


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2010 7:47 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2009 2:05 pm
Posts: 166
Location: On the road
araz2114 wrote:
Hey guys, I am looking for opinions on these 2 pistols (others may be considered also). I have the urge to get an air pistol... No real reason why, but I want one. I have a 2240 but I want one that isn't CO2.
I haven't shot either of these but my back ground is in standard pistol so I have a bit of a clue. I don't want to break the bank. I am also a machinist so I am sure I can mount a scope if I want on either of these guns.

What do you think?
Do you own either of these?
What is the speed like on these 2?
What is the accuracy like?
How is the ease of loading on them?


Any other details would be great.

Chris


Either pistol is probably going to do you well. I have more experience with the Daisy and Baikal; they both are capable of great accuracy. It comes down to what you want the gun for. Plinking: the 7XX series guns are more affordable than the Baikal and are easy to repair and maintain. Target shooting: while the 7XX series is more than capable of shooting good scores, it you are looking to develop an Olympic grip or have an eye to future competition, the Baikal is likely the better choice. I find the loading port of the 7XX series guns to be a bit fiddly, but that may be an issue of my Neanderthal fingers rather than a design shortcoming. I find the trigger on the Baikal superior to the 7XX series, although the 747/777 triggers are adjustable. Let us know what you decide to go with. Have fun.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2010 8:31 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Sep 08, 2005 6:49 pm
Posts: 207
Location: GTA
I have had a 717 and a 46M. For build quality, the 46 is better. You will definaltely have to do some work on the 46's grips if you buy one new. If you want to scope it, you can get off the shelf scope mounts for the 46. Personally my favourite was the 46, I really liked it except it was just too big. Since it's just for punching paper and not for hunting I went with a more compact gun (an Airmatch 600). If the Airmatch hadn't come up I was considering the Gamo compact.

I'd say really think what you want it for. If you want a serious entry level pistol for competition get the 46. If you want a non-CO2 pistol to punch holes in paper get the...your choice.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 12:52 am 
Offline
Site Moderator

Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2005 9:25 am
Posts: 3067
Location: Ontario, Canada
My reason for selling my IZH-46 and my two Daisy 717 pistols is the same as ScottC. They are nice pistols but I found them too big and front heavy for my purpose. My HW40 suits my needs better... shorter, lighter, easier to mount optics, decent trigger, good HW accuracy. My HW40 is creeping up on 11 years old. It's far from a 10m olympic pistol but it does well on paper or plinking. Some day I would like to try a Gamo Compact too.

Cheers,
Todd


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:32 am 
Online
Site sponsor and moderator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 2:40 pm
Posts: 5894
Location: Eastern Passage . Nova Scotia
I am with Todd the HW40/Beeman P17 is a more compact pistol and yet it has a bit more fps then the Gamo Compact
A body of mine has an HW40 which is the same in size as my P17 .
By the way I had to fix my P17 3 times in 3 years
and my body never had a problem with is HW40

Image

_________________
René


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 2:16 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 3:31 pm
Posts: 480
Location: Worcester in United Kingdom.
Just to hold the torch for the Daisy, ive found it quieter and slightly more accurate than the HW40 but agree with Todd that it probably isnt as nice a pistol.
Im also talking purely open sights too.
The 717 has a nice trigger, good sights (picture and base length appoaching good match std.) which edges the 40 benched (potl.) and a proven tested fact with the club im involved with.

The Gamo can also squeeze a tad more out in accuracy terms due to trigger and match grip adjustment but is NOT as good as the 717 in its 777 guise if you can get one.
I dislike the way the top strap on the Compact can flex slightly, being a weaker plastic than the 40.

747 or 777 if you can get it but 40 if you want to use a dot sight.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 3:21 pm 
Offline
Site Moderator

Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2005 9:25 am
Posts: 3067
Location: Ontario, Canada
Yes, the Daisy 7X7 and the IZH-46 (non-M) are two of the quietest air pistols I have owned or shot. The HW40 has a little bark but nothing like a CO2 pistol.

The HW40 is rated at 0.20"ctc for 3 shots at 10m (Beeman literature). The accuracy test that I did with mine gave an average of 0.25"ctc for 5 shots at 10 metres. I think 0.20"ctc average for 3 shots is very possible.
http://my.tbaytel.net/coopers/HW40Revie ... URACYTESTS

Many years ago, I read some accuracy ratings for the Daisy 7X7 pistols. I think it was in one of John Walters Airgun Books. The rating of 0.40"ctc seems to stick in my head for the 717. Personally, I found the older 717 pistols to be more accurate. These ones had the brass compression tubes. I have heard the 747 pistols give good accuracy but I have never tested one.

My main complaint with the 7X7 and IZH-46 was the front end weight. I had grief completing a 40 or 60 shot match without my forearm getting tight and shakey. The HW40 allowed me to complete the shooting without grief. I even managed around 90% scores with the non-competition HW40 pistol. My TAU-7 was also a more neutral balance, as was my friend's Steyr LP10 and Morini 162. Everyone finds what they like for a balance point.

The trigger on my HW40 was never worked on but it releases at a crisp 17 ounces. I never found the 717 to be anywhere near as nice. The adjustable 747 trigger would be something I would like to try.

The sight radius on the HW40 is about 190mm. A longer radius definitely helps reduce the chance of sighting error but I found the uncomfortable balance factor offsetted any sighting advantage with the 7X7. Some shooters might prefer a heavier front on their pistols so their choice would be different for an informal 10m pistol.

Here are the old results from the Highnoon Competition from year 2000. I used my HW40 (P3) during the 3 months and placed 36/54. My pistol was the cheapest and least "target type" of all the shooters. I had fun and wasn't too serious. This was also my first attempt at this sort of shooting.
http://dune.pol.lublin.pl/~dch/highnoon/hn12.gif

I enjoy SSP pistol so I can't say I wouldn't buy another 7X7 or IZH-46(M). A 747 with a scope would make a nice silhouette rig or plinker.

Cheers,
Todd


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 3:28 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2008 8:38 am
Posts: 109
Location: Near Waterloo, Ontario
You guys aren't making this easy are you? I am going to have to try them for myself... now where can I guy do that?
I am not opposed spending an extra $150 on the better gun of the group(s).
I will want to shoot this gun with iron sights and with a scope... and for 10M and field target... OH, sounds like I want too much :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

What about the HW75???? good bad or overpriced?

Decisions... Decisions...

Keep the comments coming :rolleyes:

_________________
araz2114

live each day as if it were your last...learn as if you would live forever

Carbon Express arrows The Bow Shop, Waterloo. http://www.bow-shop.com


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 4:12 pm 
Online
Site sponsor and moderator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 2:40 pm
Posts: 5894
Location: Eastern Passage . Nova Scotia
Did you check those reviews on the HW75 ?
http://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&sourc ... q=null&oq=

_________________
René


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 6:42 pm 
Offline
Site Moderator

Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2005 9:25 am
Posts: 3067
Location: Ontario, Canada
I searched for more HW75 info:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=30590&p=213330&hilit=hw75#p213330

http://www.airgunarena.com/index.php/Be ... _P2_Review

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=22359&hilit=hw75

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=22318&hilit=hw75

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=16474&hilit=+hw75

Cheers,
Todd


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 02, 2010 6:52 pm 
Offline
Site Moderator

Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2005 9:25 am
Posts: 3067
Location: Ontario, Canada
araz2114 wrote:
I will want to shoot this gun with iron sights and with a scope... and for 10M and field target... OH, sounds like I want too much :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Decisions... Decisions...

Keep the comments coming :rolleyes:


You should look for the one that can take a scope for plinking, has good iron sights and good grip for 10m, lots of powr for FT, has a butt stock attachment for plinking, converts to .22cal and 700fps for hunting, does your dishes and cuts your lawn. LOL :lol:

Serious now :D , you might want to figure out how serious you want to be with 10m shooting. If you see yourself competing then the IZH-46M is where you might want to go. However, try one first to see how you like the balance. A B-Square scope mount is available for the IZH so the pistol can have wide application.

If you only expect to "play" a bit with informal 10m shooting then the 747 or HW40 would save you some cash. Hopefully you can try them both. You could have a look at the Chinese "Beeman 2006" at CanTire and get a good idea of the HW40 feel/balance/ergonomics.

Cheers,
Todd


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 28 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
News News Site map Site map SitemapIndex SitemapIndex RSS Feed RSS Feed Channel list Channel list

Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group

phpBB SEO