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 Post subject: A few PCP question.
PostPosted: Sat Mar 11, 2023 10:55 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2023 4:05 pm
Posts: 733
I picked out a PCP to learn with. A have a few questions on non regulated and regulated.

The (non regulated) has a "choker" of sorts where I can control the fps output. This would come in handy as to not blow thru the pest and put a hole in the barn. Of course by adjusting the choke to lower power then I need to use lighter pellets.....

(Regulated) Can I do the same with the same ease? I do know every shot will be exact and not suffer the ideal curve of the non regulated one.

Am I understanding this correctly?

Help me choose! I'm going on a road trip next week to pick the unit up.

Thanks,
Gary


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 Post subject: Re: A few PCP question.
PostPosted: Sat Mar 11, 2023 11:20 am 
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Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2017 7:01 pm
Posts: 5125
Location: GTA, ON
I have limited experience on the PCPs too so I want to learn more details about this topic too~

To my understanding, reg or non-reg just because you have or haven't the regulator(s) built-in your PCP.

My CZ200 is non reg (of course you can add a regulator for it). So I adjust the Transfer Port (TP, maybe also the 'choke' you mentioned above?!) and the hammer spring preload to adjust the output.

Higher spring preload means your hammer hits the valve harder and can maintain a longer duration time on opening the valve and making more air into the chamber to push out the pellet.

And bigger TP means air can use less of time to 'fill' into the chamber.

Anyway, you need to test and find the best combination for a consistent and efficient output to suit your need / purpose.

And the regulated one has one (or more) regulator which store a certain amount of air in the plenum. So you usually can have consistent pressure output due to the help of the regulator....

And it also helps you on that you can fill up your air tube or bottle or any kinds of the air source for you gun and you can have the consistent output since the beginning to the pressure goes down and lower than the regulator setting and have more shot counts ore fill... And for the non reg PCP, if you fill higher than the 'sweet spot', your output will goes down due to pressure too high on the other side of the valve and when your hanmer striking it and couldn't open the valve long enough to let enough air out...

That's my understanding...

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 Post subject: Re: A few PCP question.
PostPosted: Sat Mar 11, 2023 12:35 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 12:35 pm
Posts: 11301
Location: P.G. B.C.
With a non-regulated PCP rifle, there will usually be a few slower shots after a complete fill, then the velocity will climb and move in an arc upwards, then down as the pressure in the tank depletes.
Adjusting the fill pressure to the start of this velocity arc & recording at what pressure the velocity again crosses the starting speed, (within 5 or 10%) will give you the range of pressure your rifle works best at. For example, Gord fills his non-regulated Air Force Talons to only 2,600psi and re-fills them to the level once reaching 1,500psi or between 1,500psi and 2,000psi to stay in the "sweet spot" for accuracy. The hammer spring tension on these rifles is adjustable. The 'range' from bottom to top is about 150fps actual speed. Somewhere in there, will be the best setting and this can only be learned by shooting - a lot.

With a regulated rifle, the pressure on the valve is constant, but if the hammer spring is too hard/stiff. air will be wasted - there must be a balance between regulator pressure and hammer spring tension, so as to not waste air. There is also a balance between those two, and the transfer port size, which restricts the final amount of air to propel the pellet. If that hole is too small for the amount of air expended from the regulator, air is being wasted, flowing out the muzzle AFTER the pellet has been discharge.

That is as I understand this phenomenon of PCP air rifles.

Some guns, like the FX say not to shoot the rifle below the regulator setting. At roughly full power, my Dreamline 'gets' about 44 shots, if I remember correctly. At low power, with the regulator turned
down to 100 bar from 135 bar, along with the transfer port turned to it's "low" setting (it has low, med and high),yet leaving the hammer spring almost at max, I get 151 shots, from full down to 100bar. I am still likely wasting air due to the high hammer spring setting, but you cannot argue with the shot count. In .25, these should be running between 500fps and 600fps judging from videos on the net.

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Daryl


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 Post subject: Re: A few PCP question.
PostPosted: Sat Mar 11, 2023 1:35 pm 
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Joined: Sat Apr 19, 2008 8:34 pm
Posts: 417
Location: 'round the corner from "the museum"
There are regulated PCPs with externally adjustable transfer ports (choke?) Which will change the power without putting it on any sort of curve.


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 Post subject: Re: A few PCP question.
PostPosted: Sat Mar 11, 2023 2:52 pm 
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Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2021 7:53 am
Posts: 551
Location: East Of Hamilton
My Kral mega is a choked unregulated gun. This past summer I would use it during the day at full power then turned it down eith the power wheel for night rating. With a 16gr pallet I can go from 975 fps to to just over 500 fps with power wheel
. I used a thin marker to mark the power wheel so I could rat at 600 fps

I could install a regulator to have a consistent high velocity and still use the power wheel for fast velocity reductions.

With the external adjustable reg gun I have, you are required to empty the tank if you want to lower the reg pressure. You can increase the reg pressure with tank full.


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 Post subject: Re: A few PCP question.
PostPosted: Sat Mar 11, 2023 10:25 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2023 4:05 pm
Posts: 733
That makes a lot of sense and thanks y'all for the replies. I did use the search and read a fair bit but soon glazed over and couldn't keep focused. lol

I'll post some pics next weekend. :drinkers:


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 Post subject: Re: A few PCP question.
PostPosted: Sat Mar 11, 2023 10:27 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 12:35 pm
Posts: 11301
Location: P.G. B.C.
With the FX Drealmine and hammer spring at the top, my 'regulation' to go from full power at 44 shots to a fill on the 280cc tank, to
151 shots with the regulator turned down to 100 bar from 135 bar, and choke on the transfer port to low from high. That is still with the
hammer spring at top pressure. I suspect the count to go up, maybe to 200shots if the hammer spring was turned down. I do not know
that count, for a fact. Makes sense though with no wasted air following the pellet out the bore.

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Daryl


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 Post subject: Re: A few PCP question.
PostPosted: Sun Mar 12, 2023 1:18 pm 
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Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2014 3:26 pm
Posts: 831
Location: Alberta
I would think one needs a FPS on each setting to know how gun is doing in speed and shot count


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 Post subject: Re: A few PCP question.
PostPosted: Sun Mar 12, 2023 1:37 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 12:35 pm
Posts: 11301
Location: P.G. B.C.
That would be all data, but not necessary for shot count. All you have to do is to fill the rifle and shoot until the pressure is down to the regulator set level and count the number of shots fired.
That is how I tested & counted mine. Knowing the vel. is just another test and data for compilation. This may or may not be done this spring. Going to be a busy spring, though.

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Daryl


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 Post subject: Re: A few PCP question.
PostPosted: Sun Mar 12, 2023 1:51 pm 
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Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2014 3:26 pm
Posts: 831
Location: Alberta
Collecting data FPS shot count is the fun part 8)


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