Canadian Airgun Forum

Someone above mentioned the 8mm.

That is the largest rifle bore I've shot.
Personally, the 7.92 x 57 as loaded by Remington is a total pussycat~ with recoil a bit lighter than a .410 smoothbore.
In my Brazilian(?) '93 mauser, very accurate.

Largest handgun bore I've shot was the old K-66 Combat in some pretty warm home rolled .357 mag loads.
Contrary to popular belief, the factory combat grips that came with it handle recoil the best.
The synthetic pachymars we tried on it left some pretty good palm bruising.

The absolute worst recoil from a shoulder arm came in the form of a Spanish FR-8 shooting some PRVI Partizan soft points~ machine gun ammo with the FMJ's pulled for a 150 gr. soft point. My gunsmith pointed out the link marks on the cases from the m/g belting.
The split at the wrist stock didn't help recoil matters much.
I've since come to my senses and replaced the oil soaked wood and steel butt plate stock with a cheap composite stock with a good rubber pad and normal factory ammo. What a huge difference.

My most shot and still favorite though, is still the .22 Long Rifle. Talk about love affair.

-D.S.

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"Ain't no half-way"
-S.R.V.

Yeah I never understood why the American companies load such anemic 8x57 rounds. That's why I hand load for my Mauser k98k and it likes them hot!

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Air Arms HFT 500
FX Streamline laminate .22
Benjamin Discovery .22 (tuned)
Weihrauch HW30S .177
Weihrauch HW30 MK1 .177
Weihrauch HW40
Beeman P17
Crosman 22xx carbine (tuned)
Princess Auto Super Springer Deluxe ($34.99)

That is to prevent litigation from someone loading them into one of the older Mauser tube mag rifles, and having the gun fail while it's being shot.

-D.S.

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"Ain't no half-way"
-S.R.V.

The only tube magazine Mauser I know of, is the model 71/84 repeater. The bullets for that one, were paper patched back in it's 'day' and were round nosed, but dead soft lead. In the 1900's Dominion/Imperial made the 11mm Mauser ammo with grooved lubricated bullets that were round nosed. I've not heard of any of those rifles blowing up.
All 8x57's, I think more accurately called 7.9x57, were box magazine fed, the first in that calibre being the Model 1888.
Not only is the American ammo for 8x57JS loaded to only about 35,000psi, it is also loaded with .321" bullets. The "only" reason for this, is the older M88 Mausers and early model 98 Mausers had
.318" groove diameters. The 'soft' loading and undersized bullets guarantees the ammo will not blow up the "tight" 8x57's or 7.9x57's, usually noted as "J" models, not "JS" which means .323" groove diameters.
Shooting .323" bullets in a chamber designed for .318" bullets causes a pressure spike due to the chamber neck not allowing the case mouth/neck to expand to release the oversized bullet. In some of the J chambered rifles, S ammunition with .323" bullets cannot even be chambered.
Guys have, in the past, used "chucking" reamers to open up the necks of tight "J" chambered rifles, to allow them to use even the European, 57,000psi factory 8x57S ammo by Norma, Sako, RWS and DWM, which have .323" bullets. If the chamber neck is large enough to allow the case neck to expand properly to release the bullet, no adverse pressure will be generated. This even "goes" for the old model 1888 Mausers.

Rifles having tubular magazines wherein the nose of the bullet behind, is pressing against the primer of the bullet ahead of it, happens to be mostly with lever action rifles. This was a "thing" back in the 1800's as well.
Even round nose bullets can cause a detonation in the magazine tube, which is why back in 1881, when Marlin made the first lever actioned rifle with an action long enough to work with the .45/70 Govt. ctg., the ammo for it was called ".45/70 Marlin" as it had a flat nosed bullet instead of the round nosed 405gr. military and commercial ammo for the .45/70 "Gvt. "ctg.
It is also why today, Hornady makes 2 almost identical 350gr. soft nosed bullets. The original 350gr. Hornady was round nosed, however in the 1990's(I think), they brought out the same weight bullet with 2 cannelures (for different seating depths for different rifles) & a flat nose to prevent detonation. That means there are 2, 350gr. bullets in .458". After 2000, they brought out a 325gr. .458" spitzer, but having a soft rubber nose. This improved ballistics as that one had a much higher Ballistic Coefficient, yet was safe in tubular magazines.

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Best Wishes
Daryl

It was the '88 that concerned the american ammo manufacturers the most, alongside the importers rechambered guns.
The bit on tube mags was a brain fart on my part.
DeHaas covers this issue in surprisingly good detail in the book Bolt Action Rifles.
The second or third edition is the one to look for.

-D.S.

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"Ain't no half-way"
-S.R.V.

Frank's books are good, yes.

Even the 98's with "J" chambers experience a lot of problems with "JS" ammo, but no problems in 'opened' necks or chambers that allowed expansion to release the bullet.
The first thing to check, is a fired case - will it allow a .323" bullet to easily slide into the neck? If it will, it is OK to fire European 8x57JS ammo.

P/O/ Ackley did a lot of experimentation with oversized bullets in ctgs., right up to a .30/06 with normal 'factory type' 150gr. loads, but using a 150gr. .35 cal bullet. He had to open up the neck to allow what amounted to a .35 Whelen to be chambered and his pressure testing showed no pressure increase over the factory loaded 150gr. .308 bullet, but did produce slightly higher velocity.

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Best Wishes
Daryl

I no longer own any English doubles, and tend to stay off of those forums as I still miss them. Just too much recoil and too expensive at my age.

I've not fired a .500 Barnes Supreme but it sounds to be "unkind".

We noticed that larger, beefy guys seemed to be hammered more badly than we smaller, lighter types, perhaps because we began to move back sooner so tha butt didn't dig as deeply?

I've fired 100 rounds of 375 H&H, 450 Ackley, and some other heavy stuff in an afternoon's shooting ice at 5 Finger Rapids in the Yukon River. Spend the next couple of days lecturing with my left hand clamping my neck because of whip-lash, but keen to do it again the next weekend. Mom never said I was her brightest child.



FWIW, the trick we learned for doubling SxS guns is to reverse ones fingers. Second finger on the front trigger, index finger on the back trigger. That seems to place the second finger's first knuckle out of harms way. I clearly recall seeing the white innards of my second finger joint from a couple of "Oops."

You are certainly right that some guns kick and others not so much. My nastiest was a very light Parker Hale Mauser in .323 Hollis. That was no one's friend, on either end. IIRC 200 gr Norma Dual Cores at 3400 fps, and cruel recoil. It destroyed 3 decent scopes. Broke the crosshairs in a Redfield, tore the occular len's stepped cone's rim off a Weaver, and did in another but can't recall. It was almost as good on thrown bottles as my .360 #2 NE double, but mean! Most of my friends would only agree to one shot.

It was light, but IDK what else made it so nasty. It cracked the stock, which only stayed together with a couple of cross pins and two cross bolts. Even at that, Arcriglas would not stay in it until I glassed in a steel block. I'd be in Emergency if I fired it today.

IIRC, you mentioned uncomfortable hand guns. The grip sure makes a difference, doesn't it?

I had a Colt Police Positive Special in .38 Special, which was an ex-CPR Police revolver. Small frame and the bottom of the butt was inline with my 3rd finger. It was none to pleasant with full power .38 loads, but I used to drop .357 Magnum loads in .38 cases, back in the days, for lack of sufficient brass. Since they only went into my guns, no problem. I shot them in a large frame S&W.

I used to have fun at the range with that little revolver because it was back in Dirty Harry days when everyone was buying 44 Magnum revolvers to target and shoot combat. I could score better with 357 even with the handicap, but got ribbing about it being a lady's gun.

I used to drop in one 357 load in the first chamber of the little Colt, then 5 38's behind that.

I'd coach one of the "man's gun" types into shooting the little 38. When one touched that thing off, one's hand seized up and went numb, then the pain started. The only way to get it out was to use the other hand to pull the Colt out of the hand because the shooting hand was paralyzed. Then the pain was so bad that it seemed like it had blown the hand off. It went kind of like this: smirking at the tiny pop gun, cock, aim, trigger, look of surprise, then huge eyes, eyes would start to water, face with complete dumbfounded shock, then more pain, panic, gingerly pulling the gun from the hand, hand under armpit, all the time trying to pretend nothing happened, despite the laughter.

People would put their hand under the other arm pit, and decline further shots, having just remembered an urgent errand. LOL

The other guys, who had already had the lesson, would stand around stifling laughter. No one ever made "lady's gun" comments after that. LOL

I'd encourage the shooter to empty the gun, but no one was up to that, so I'd rapid, double action the other five. No one ever figured out that I was selectively loading.

I do have to admit to not firing more than a few of those "lady gun" 357 magnums in the Colt. It certainly wasn't bothered, as the gunsmiths said that it wouldn't be.

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Slavia 618 .177
Webley Senior .22
Jelly SUPER 4.5 mm
Webley Viscount .177
Kral Mega Marine Walnut .22
Artemis PP750 .22
FX Streamline .22 walnut
FX Streamline .22 composite
FX Dynamic 500 .22

That effect was like the German squeeze bore guns, correct.

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Slavia 618 .177
Webley Senior .22
Jelly SUPER 4.5 mm
Webley Viscount .177
Kral Mega Marine Walnut .22
Artemis PP750 .22
FX Streamline .22 walnut
FX Streamline .22 composite
FX Dynamic 500 .22

Sorry missed this note. Yes, in a way, but the German squeeze bore was tapered from the breech to the muzzle. When P.O. Ackley did his tests, he was attempting to prove that once the bullet is past the throat, it is quite easily reduced to groove diameter by the tapered throat of 3 or so degrees and will not create more pressure than a properly sized bullet. He also mentioned that the chamber neck must be large enough to allow the bullet to be discharged from the case WITHOUT burning more powder in the case, than necessary. If the case mouth cannot expand to release the bullet, more powder will be consumed inside the case to instantly swage it down, thus possibly increasing the pressure of that round. This can be dangerous.

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Best Wishes
Daryl

I have owned muzzle loaders recoil is mild but always a real pleasure to shoot. I bought a winchester 70 featherweight in 30-06 that I thought had a real thump to it until I tried a 458 winchester magnum. I was only given one round to shoot due to the cost of them but thats all I really needed anyways. I stepped way into it and was still taken by surprise. I would love to see what it does to a water buffalo. As for the most uncomfortable probably the kel tech ksg in 12ga with hot loads. I guess it would ruin it or something to have a wider butt pad on them.

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Don’t sell your guns, they just turn into money and disappear.
-An actual quote from my loving wife-

Same here... or 81mm mortar, but again, the baseplate took the recoil

Largest caliber in a rifle?
- Ruger#1 in 460 Weatherby...

Here are two of my boomers.

My .416 Remington squirts out a 350gr Barnes X solid bronze hollow point at 2725 fps and 5,772 fpe. It will put 2000fpe on a target half a kilometer away with the same trajectory as a .270. I built it on a Pattern 14 Enfield (Remington). I built it's twin in .375 H&H too.

My .458 Win will exceed 5000 fpe with full loads.
I built my .458 on a VZ24 98 Mauser with a 1/22 twist barrel rather than the standard 1/14 twist. It has a williams foolproof receiver sight and a ramp with bead front sight. Recoil is manageable with a muzzle brake. Before I put a brake on it, it shattered a synthetic stock. Bruised more than a few shoulders too. It's a little light for a .458. I mostly shoot it with cast 500gr gas check at 1700 fps for 3200 fpe. I like shooting boulders with it in a nearby gravel pit.

I put brakes on all of my powder burners over 30-06 power level. I'm old. I bruise easily.

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Theory is when you know how something works, but it doesn't.
Practice is when something works, but you don't know why.
In my shop, Theory and Practice are combined!
Nothing works and I don't know why.

Two lathes and too many projects

.50 BMG Barrett ................577 snider