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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 6:24 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2006 11:27 am
Posts: 4512
Location: R.R. #3 Simhoe
This Main Set of Springs were made for my 1961 Walther LP-53 back acouple of 3-years ago or maybe more, don't remember I wasn't doin to well then. But it was alot harder to install then the original onesx2. BUT :!: It has not unscrewed itself ever not once as of yet and I shoot this AG alot more then any of the other 20 or so I own. Sounds like your writting from the UK, you wouldn't like me speaking my mind about your, well you prove my point. I do have many friends from the UK that have moved here back when I was a child in the very early 1960's that are decent people. But you've got some serious issues bud. No win, no foul... :lol: I won't be responding to this post again. But buddy here most likely will, of course 8)

KM...

Maybe I should set-up my new Fuji and take a Movie of it doing this velocity showing the Chrony's reading ? Not :!: I don't have to prove my findings to a fool :o Oh ya, my Nutz are fine :lol:

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 Post subject: Tempest mod
PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 6:27 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 3:31 pm
Posts: 480
Location: Worcester in United Kingdom.
Heres a nice Mod for the Tempest for interested parties.

The Tempest, unlike the other Webleys, utilises a separate fitted spring guide.
In otherwords, it is not screwed into the compression tube to become one with the gun.
It sits inside, under the mainspring, and then is held with a small roll pin driven through the main body.
Just remove this, and retain...theres no need to destroy just keep for resale purposes....thus not a permanent mod!
Now, replicate the guide in moly impregnated Nylon.
Any marine quality nylon will do, or Delrin A/F.
When exactly copied, refit as you would the other guide.
There is a good worthwhile improvement.
There is a fair bit of spring bind over, when cocking Webleys, where some rubbing of steel on spring will take place.
This Nylon guide wil reduce friction and increase smoothness.
I tested with Mosi, getting about 25 fps and and no spring twang at all.
The mod took about 20 minutes to turn up.

Strangely i got nothing from this on the HW45 pistol.
I suspect that it is due to the spring remaining perfectly straight in this design, and thus no improvemnt was noticed, indeed i cannot improve this gun for you.
The Germans seem to have gotten it right first time out.
Some have experimented with fitting the guide in the other direction (down inside the piston, and vice versa) but no difference is documented.
The Gun religously prefers flat head pellets in accuracy tests.
Its good but a little bulky after handling a Webley.


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 Post subject: Easy
PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 6:48 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 3:31 pm
Posts: 480
Location: Worcester in United Kingdom.
Dude, for the record i was born in Edmonton but do now consider myself reasonably English having lived here since 5 years of age.
Its unfortunate that we gotten off on the wrong foot but a 53 doing 495 would be a religeous experience.......

Sadly the pistol (regardless of Herculian springs of 3ft length and some) will never have more than its tiny 3 inch stroke in the short cylinder housed in the grip.
It just cannot generate the power.
Spring tensions alone just dont improve power.
They just add more force needed for cocking, noise and twang.
Its the swept volume that creates the power, provided the spring is adequate.

This is why i once took the dramatic step that i will explain here.

I loved this gun in my 20s but could never get it moving past 380 fps.
I tried the spring on its own, and then with 2, incredibly there is almost no difference...they just didnt know it was all about swept volume back then!
Thus, i took the ridiculous (a bit crazy in my mid 20s) of attempting to deepen the piston in the main body just above the trigger.
I set up a 28mm diameter drill, ground witha flat bottom in the milling m/c.
There is only 4 mm more depth before the drill would have burst through into the outside world.
I really needed to leave 2mm for strength, but this was still risky.
It worked, i got the extra 2mm of stroke but it still hasnt breached the 410fps area.
I enjoyed the project though, and this is the main thing.

Sadly, this best looking ever piece...with the function of a fine swiss watch just cannot get above 410 fps...so many have tried and failed, incl. me.

There are attempts to gas cartidge this weapon ahead.
Some dude came up with the idea of machining the piston area with speacial valves and locations, to allow a 12 gram gas bulb to be used.
The barrel is plenty long enough for fine return, while the tool would also be recoiless.
I have mailed the individual about his progress.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 8:52 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2006 11:27 am
Posts: 4512
Location: R.R. #3 Simhoe
:(-Arse :lol:

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 9:48 pm 
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Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2005 11:03 pm
Posts: 5330
Location: home of the Marshville Festival, Ontario, Canada
Stephen wrote:
*Regards LP53* - All owners be careful not to let this go unoticed, the cap will eventually fly off.....

Hmmmm - I've been collecting and shooting LP53 variants for decades, and this is the first I had ever heard of this happening.....perhaps you are doing something wrong???

Stephen wrote:
I will be hanging onto the Webleys with the possibility that the company is about to go bust.

Better double check that one - Webley DID go bust a year or two ago.

Stephen wrote:
*Regards LP53* - There are attempts to gas cartidge this weapon ahead.
Some dude came up with the idea of machining the piston area with speacial valves and locations, to allow a 12 gram gas bulb to be used.

The CO2 modded LP53s have been around for a few years now, and I have had occassion to examine them "in hand". They are actually bulk filled, due to design constraints which excluded the use of the CO2 cartridges.

Stephen wrote:
The Tempest, unlike the other Webleys, utilises a separate fitted spring guide.
In otherwords, it is not screwed into the compression tube to become one with the gun.
It sits inside, under the mainspring, and then is held with a small roll pin driven through the main body.

REALLY ???? You mean this Webley Tempest?
http://www.gunspares.co.uk/showcatimage.asp?id=24546
Please enlighten me - when did they eliminate part #SG043 - the one piece main tube end plug with the spring guide? This part has been common to the Hurricane, Typhoon, and Tempest since they were first introduced, and remained so to the cessation of production, to the best of my knowledge, since no-one, including Webley, prior to their untimely demise, has ever issued an update to that particular parts drawing. Please give a serial number range for this major engineering change, to quantify your statement.

And, just for the record - I have no problem with folks modifying a "utility grade" airgun - in fact, I have done so myself. I simply stated my opinion of a mod that IMO, is of questionable merit based upon my own knowledge of the gun. Based upon some of your other statements here, it appears to me that much of your advice and info is of questionable merit.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 10:12 pm 
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Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2007 10:40 am
Posts: 31
Location: Montreal, Quebec
now this is some hilarious sh.... didn't think an air gun forum could get as bad as those dumb martial arts ones... ill just get some popcorn and enjoy a good laugh on you guys :)


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 Post subject: Variants
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 6:15 am 
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Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 3:31 pm
Posts: 480
Location: Worcester in United Kingdom.
Your being a bit of a picky buttock when discussing variants.
OfCOURSE the Tempest, Hurricane and Typhoon (slightly smaller mainspring) are similar.
I was talking about Tempest, Senior, Premier, and MK1...where they are all different in piston design.

For clarity, the point i was trying to make is that the The Premier, and Senior have threaded Guide rods, while the Tempest (and its variants for picky asses) are different, being held with a role pin below the cheap plastic shroud (always hated that part)

I am unaware that some one over on your side of the pond has already done a Walther...thats great.
....but being a one off modding shop or custom house....anyone could be forgiven for not knowing about it.....why the critisism?
Obviously this guy at Malpas who is doing the mod, could have copied from the outfit ......do you have any details?


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 Post subject: buttock
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 6:20 am 
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Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 3:31 pm
Posts: 480
Location: Worcester in United Kingdom.
As regard "buttock"....education is often irritating.....but finding out about swept volume should be enlightening...it was to me....sure as hell wished i had known about it in the 80s!!!! (i would never have pratted around with all those mainsprings!)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 12:58 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2006 11:27 am
Posts: 4512
Location: R.R. #3 Simhoe
Here's Mine:

Image

Here's the new Leather Seal:

Image

Image

I just realized that when I installed that spring from Titian Spring, the Wire Dia. was atad bit bigger. And no theres no coil bind at all. It was specially made for the LP-53...

KM...

EDIT: The Rear Site had to be changed because the original one got broken by accident. I still have it, but have to put a small allen headed screw in it for repair... :wink:

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 Post subject: Nice Gun
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 1:18 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 3:31 pm
Posts: 480
Location: Worcester in United Kingdom.
Nice Gun, its the same as mine, except ive never owned the actual barrel weight.
That piston head unit looks almost identical to the design i developed, where a screw seems to have replaced the rivetted head of the original model.
This is a much better idea as it allows the fitting/experimenting of different heads.
I chose a PTFE head, of shorter design and feather edged it like that fitted to many new pistol designs.
It works very well from an efficiency point of view but will probably not match the consistantcy of your leather one there.

Trouble with PTFE is that will have more slip (lowest known coefficient of friction known to man) but is temperature fussy.
Leather is not.
Unfortunately the old Walthr stock has all dried out.
One i bought from Surrey guns, simply disintergrated when i tried to assemble (paid £12 for the privelage too)
Use Linseed to soak your washer.
The condition looks good, so it should last you.


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 Post subject: More
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 1:35 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 3:31 pm
Posts: 480
Location: Worcester in United Kingdom.
The design of your head appears to have designed "out" the need for the rubber buffer head...like i did.
The buffer is totally surplus to requirements ofcourse but they didnt know that back then.

You could possibly trim it back a little toward the nylon inner spacer, which will give you slightly more volume/stroke.
I found that velocity improved by about 15fps per mm.
You will have a few mm in cocking slot clearance to allow for this but everything you do will be quite minimal.

The LP2 is even finer but pneumatic in principal.
I had one for a while but sadly the valves fail all to quickly.
They never had O rings unfortunately, and any attempt to replace/repair is a miserable job of great difficulty.
The gun can hit 400fps from the tiny resevoir but only in a good and rare model.
Replacement/repair will never leave the gun quite the same way so be warned if any of you attempt this.
Basically, a bit like trying to repair a Swiss watch (youll probably make a hash of it!)
My re sealed weapon only ever managed about 360fps after that but but it could shoot 1/4 the group size of "up jumper"!

The later lp3 was not quite so nice but slightly more reliable.
The eliptical barrel was replaced with a round version to reduce cost but it could be had witha walnut target grip for extra cost if wanted.


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 Post subject: Mine
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 1:56 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 3:31 pm
Posts: 480
Location: Worcester in United Kingdom.
Image


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 Post subject: My site
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 1:59 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 3:31 pm
Posts: 480
Location: Worcester in United Kingdom.
Thats the website of my site but its often down (as it is at the moment)
My Walther is on the front page.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 2:22 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2006 11:27 am
Posts: 4512
Location: R.R. #3 Simhoe
That new leather seal is the relacement I had installed inplace of that rubber one your speaking of. Mine was all dried out also. Ever since I did this complete rebuild it shoots as I've previously said. I couldn't believe what the Chrony was showing as I had to do this for my own sanity numerous times. Why are airguns, and parts so expensive $$$ in the UK ? I just can't understand this :roll: Like the whole repair kit including the spring, piston seal and anew piston also all for $97.xxusd back afew years ago. I bought this AG off of an Police Officer from Cambridge Ontario for $75.cnd After I found out there actual value I was very surprised. It came with the different Blades for the rear site, plus the 3 front site blades also. The weight set for the barrel. Owners manual with the site in sig. from the guy back in 1961. Actually this type of AG was used in an James Bond Movie Poster only, because Sean Connery forgot his PPK-38

Image

Mike... :)

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 Post subject: Re: Lp53
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 3:33 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2007 3:10 pm
Posts: 507
Location: Nova Scotia
Stephen wrote:
Now theres some bull litter if ive ever heard it.
I also tune this weapon (you have too since all the leather washer heads are gone for ever, or dried out)

It will never...ever do 495fps.


maybe this is just me?
but it bothers the hell out of me when someone refers to an airgun or even a firearm for that matter as a "weapon" in anything other than law enforcement and military applications

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