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 Post subject: HFT Rules Question
PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 11:04 am 
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I posted these questions in the FT rules sticky with no response.... perhaps it doesn't get a "new post" flag.... so I'll redo them here.... For Hunter FT the rules state:

Quote:
A.... Match air guns may be used, but must have all adjustable parts at their minimum placement.

If (a portion of) the forestock is dropped to improve the hold when standing or kneeling, is that OK?.... If so , does it have to be fixed (ie not adjustable vertically or removable)....

Quote:
H. Knee risers and thigh rests, either attached to the rifle, or held separately, will not be allowed.

Does this rule refer to something that actually sits on the knee or thigh (ie supporting the gun directly and not through the leading hand).... If so, I presume the dropped forestock I asked about above could not sit directly on the knee?....

Quote:
7. Shooting Position - B. Kneeling.... The leading hand may not be supported in any way.

I assume the elbow of the leading hand may rest on the knee?....

Bob

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 Post subject: Re: HFT Rules Question
PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 11:58 am 
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I only shoot Hunter FT once or twice a year so I'm no expert. From what I understand, fore-ends/cheek pieces/adjustable butt plates etc. must be completely in or in the case of the buttplate, completely flatened out. I think the rules are to allow target shooters with only one gun to participate but to discourage people from circumventing the spirit of the shoot to get an unfair advantage. In open class, some use tall sand bags to support the rifle but in Hunter, they are not allowed. The support elbow can rest on the knee but you can't be sneaky and set up a bipod sandwiching your hand between it and the rifle. Hope this helps...

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 Post subject: Re: HFT Rules Question
PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 4:21 pm 
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Location: Greater Napanee, ON, Canada
rsterne wrote:
I posted these questions in the FT rules sticky with no response.... perhaps it doesn't get a "new post" flag.... so I'll redo them here.... For Hunter FT the rules state:

Quote:
A.... Match air guns may be used, but must have all adjustable parts at their minimum placement.

If (a portion of) the forestock is dropped to improve the hold when standing or kneeling, is that OK?.... If so , does it have to be fixed (ie not adjustable vertically or removable)....

Quote:
H. Knee risers and thigh rests, either attached to the rifle, or held separately, will not be allowed.

Does this rule refer to something that actually sits on the knee or thigh (ie supporting the gun directly and not through the leading hand).... If so, I presume the dropped forestock I asked about above could not sit directly on the knee?....

Quote:
7. Shooting Position - B. Kneeling.... The leading hand may not be supported in any way.

I assume the elbow of the leading hand may rest on the knee?....

Bob


If the portion of the fore stock that is dropped is a solid piece of the stock, that is fine. If the piece is adjustable, it has to be set as close to the rifle as possible or at its minimum setting. The same rule applies to an adjustable cheek piece; it must be at its minimum setting.

If the adjustable fore stock is at its minimum and does not have padding added to it, it may sit directly on the knee. You cannot put padding between the knee and the stock.

You may put your elbow or forearm on your knee with the wrist above or not touching the knee. The hand cannot be placed on the knee forming a solid base. As long as the hand is off a solid surface and supported by the wrist, that's fine.

Thanks for your interest. If you have any other questions, feel free to ask.

Happy New Year.

Tim

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 Post subject: Re: HFT Rules Question
PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:18 pm 
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HI Tim....

Thanks for the very precise answers to my questions.... I'm working on a .177 22XX PCP HFT (how's that for a mouthful!) right now and wanted to customize the stock but make sure it meets the rules for HFT (basically non-adjustable or set at minimum).... I have a couple of additional questions....

If the dropped section of a non-adjustable forestock touches the ground is that OK in Prone? (I would imagine not).... or does the same rule apply as in Kneeling, that from the wrist forward the hand must be unsupported?.... or is there some other interpretation of Prone?....

Regarding the use of a Monopod in HFT.... There is a lengthy description in Section H. Monopods.... I am interested in the last sentence:

Quote:
The monopod will not have any addition attachments to it that give rigid lateral or longitudinal support to the rifle, as if it was sitting on a bench or in a fitted notch or channel.

Would it be permissable to have a convex end on the monopod and a hole in the forestock that allowed the monopod to drop out if the rifle is lifted (ie NOT attached) and also allowed the monopod to move through an angle (say 10 degrees) in all directions?.... In other words, the attachment would be neither "rigid" or "fitted".... Specifically I was thinking of having, say, a 1/2" radius on the end of the monopod and an oversize hole in the forestock that was drilled with a typical twist drill (slight taper on the bottom of the hole).... I don't think this would have any advantage over a soft padded top on the monopod which could conform to the forestock of the rifle.... which I assume is legal?....

Thanks....

Bob

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Airsonal;
Too many! Springers, Pumpers, CO2, but I love my PCPs and developing them!
Proud Member of the 2000+fps Club!


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 Post subject: Re: HFT Rules Question
PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2010 1:32 am 
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Location: Greater Napanee, ON, Canada
rsterne wrote:
HI Tim....

Thanks for the very precise answers to my questions.... I'm working on a .177 22XX PCP HFT (how's that for a mouthful!) right now and wanted to customize the stock but make sure it meets the rules for HFT (basically non-adjustable or set at minimum).... I have a couple of additional questions....

If the dropped section of a non-adjustable forestock touches the ground is that OK in Prone? (I would imagine not).... or does the same rule apply as in Kneeling, that from the wrist forward the hand must be unsupported?.... or is there some other interpretation of Prone?....

Regarding the use of a Monopod in HFT.... There is a lengthy description in Section H. Monopods.... I am interested in the last sentence:

Quote:
The monopod will not have any addition attachments to it that give rigid lateral or longitudinal support to the rifle, as if it was sitting on a bench or in a fitted notch or channel.

Would it be permissable to have a convex end on the monopod and a hole in the forestock that allowed the monopod to drop out if the rifle is lifted (ie NOT attached) and also allowed the monopod to move through an angle (say 10 degrees) in all directions?.... In other words, the attachment would be neither "rigid" or "fitted".... Specifically I was thinking of having, say, a 1/2" radius on the end of the monopod and an oversize hole in the forestock that was drilled with a typical twist drill (slight taper on the bottom of the hole).... I don't think this would have any advantage over a soft padded top on the monopod which could conform to the forestock of the rifle.... which I assume is legal?....

Thanks....

Bob

You are correct; the rifle cannot touch the ground, only your elbows and body can touch the ground or mat and the gun is supported by your hand as in kneeling and your shoulder.

The mono-pod you describe seems to fit the "fitted notch" mentioned in the rules as being illegal. The gun should be able to be moved forward or backward on the top of the mono-pod and tilt in all directions. The mono-pod takes the weight of the gun only and does not offer a great deal of stability otherwise. Many are using a commercially made mono-pod that has a top in the shape of a "V". The gun sits in the "V" and as long a you do not shape your stock to fit the "V", that is fine. The top of the mono-pod cannot have pad that conforms to the stock; it can only have a surface that prevents damage to the stock.

Tim

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 Post subject: Re: HFT Rules Question
PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2010 11:07 am 
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OK got that.... no hole in the stock.... :oops:

Are you familiar with a monopod fitting called a "Little Sure Shot"?.... It has a clamp that will slide over a stick on one side with a knob to tighten the clamp on the other side and is a total of about 6.5" long and 1" wide.... In between is an area 2.75" wide by 1" padded with a piece of what looks like 1/4" neoprene.... This area is concave, with about 3/4" of curvature in the 2.75" of length.... This padded area meets the size criteria for
Quote:
They will not have a surface larger than two (2) inches by three (3) inches on the top, to rest the rifle on.
.... I assume this would be OK?.... I can post a photo if needed....

Bob

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Dominion Marksman Silver Shield - 5890 x 6000 in 1976, and downhill ever since!
Airsonal;
Too many! Springers, Pumpers, CO2, but I love my PCPs and developing them!
Proud Member of the 2000+fps Club!


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 Post subject: Re: HFT Rules Question
PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2010 12:48 pm 
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Here's a mono-pod that has been OK'd for use in HFT in one config and not OK if used with the strap...
Primos Trigger Stick
ImageImage

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 Post subject: Re: HFT Rules Question
PostPosted: Fri Jan 01, 2010 2:26 pm 
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Here is a photo of the "Little Sure Shot" attached to a stick.... It can move up and down the stick to adjust the height.... 8)

Attachment:
Monopod.JPG

The length of the padded area is 2.8" and it measures 1" wide.... I assume this would meet the rules for HFT ?....

Bob

_________________
Dominion Marksman Silver Shield - 5890 x 6000 in 1976, and downhill ever since!
Airsonal;
Too many! Springers, Pumpers, CO2, but I love my PCPs and developing them!
Proud Member of the 2000+fps Club!


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 Post subject: Re: HFT Rules Question
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 11:25 am 
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Perhaps the above question about the "Little Sure Shot" got lost?

Thanks....

Bob

_________________
Dominion Marksman Silver Shield - 5890 x 6000 in 1976, and downhill ever since!
Airsonal;
Too many! Springers, Pumpers, CO2, but I love my PCPs and developing them!
Proud Member of the 2000+fps Club!


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 Post subject: Re: HFT Rules Question
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 4:54 pm 
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Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2007 9:21 pm
Posts: 2102
Location: Greater Napanee, ON, Canada
rsterne wrote:
Perhaps the above question about the "Little Sure Shot" got lost?

Thanks....

Bob


This is a busy time of year for me anyways; I am seldom home and usually get to the computer very late at night. Celebrating the Season with family and food has been my priorities over the last week or so.

The Little Sure Shot does provide a possibility that the Trigger Stick shown by Parker does not. The gun could be held against the post and the Sure Shot used to simply hold the gun up. If used that way, it would be illegal due to the lateral support. If used with the stock resting only in the rounded out area, it basically would be in line with the rule.

Just my opinion, but, with the offset nature of the Sure Shot, I would guess it would not be near as stable as the Trigger Stick that lines up everything through one vertical axis.

Tim

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 Post subject: Re: HFT Rules Question
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2010 5:03 pm 
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If used with the stock resting only in the rounded out area, it basically would be in line with the rule.

That's all I needed to know.... 8)

Thanks again....

Bob

_________________
Dominion Marksman Silver Shield - 5890 x 6000 in 1976, and downhill ever since!
Airsonal;
Too many! Springers, Pumpers, CO2, but I love my PCPs and developing them!
Proud Member of the 2000+fps Club!


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