Canadian Airgun Forum

The #1 Community for Airguns in Canada!
It is currently Sun Nov 17, 2019 8:26 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours


The Canadian Airgun Forums are a place for people to discuss and learn about airguns and the airgunning sport in Canada. There are lots of discussions about airguns, airgun accessories, reviews, modification and repair information, airgun events, field target and free classifieds!

 

You need to register before you can post: click the register link to proceed. Before you register, please read the forum rules. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload your own pictures, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple, and absolutely free! To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.








Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 22 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: ruger blackhawk .177
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2013 1:44 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2013 11:16 pm
Posts: 7
hey all, been playing with a new low end pellet gun from ct, overall it is okay for what you pay, but with time I'm regretting not buying better. been looking at archer airgun breech seal mod, hideously expensive to ship to Canada. is it worth the money?, are there alternatives ?,I am aware that the main spring can be easily changed but not a clue where to access them. I'm sure shipping again will be a big negative. Open to suggests/help. thanks in advance


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ruger blackhawk .177
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 10:08 am 
Offline
Supporting Member 2009
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2006 12:37 am
Posts: 3468
Location: Out There
http://scopesandammo.com/storefront/pro ... -kit-p-848

_________________
www.scopesandammo.com/storefront



Please note: I do not conduct business through Private Messages (PM's) in online forums. Please do not send a 'PM" with a business-related question.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ruger blackhawk .177
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 8:32 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jul 27, 2013 11:51 am
Posts: 1050
Location: Toronto Suburb
Hey Eric what exactly does that kit do for an Airhawk 490 ?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ruger blackhawk .177
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 10:18 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2013 11:16 pm
Posts: 7
firstly, thx for the link, that certainly does address my issue....... is it also your opinion that the archer oring/gasket for the breech seal is not worth considering? I mostly likely will use the link, but curious none the less


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ruger blackhawk .177
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 7:59 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 01, 2009 3:23 pm
Posts: 3067
Location: Northern Ontario
alfard wrote:
firstly, thx for the link, that certainly does address my issue....... is it also your opinion that the archer oring/gasket for the breech seal is not worth considering? I mostly likely will use the link, but curious none the less


For the cost of shipping it to Canada, no.
You can make one yourself. They are just shims to make the breach seal tighter.

You can also try this one http://vortekproducts.com/ourstore/RWS34BH more money than the OEM stuff from Eric, but people say they are great.

_________________
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." - Thomas Jefferson.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ruger blackhawk .177
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 7:59 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 01, 2009 3:23 pm
Posts: 3067
Location: Northern Ontario
twister wrote:
Hey Eric what exactly does that kit do for an Airhawk 490 ?


They are full power replacement parts. You will need a PAL to install them.

_________________
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." - Thomas Jefferson.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ruger blackhawk .177
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 10:30 am 
Offline
Supporting Member 2009
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2006 12:37 am
Posts: 3468
Location: Out There
As some may recall, I sold Vortek kits actively for a year or two- they do not, generally, output any more power than the stock (full power) parts other than a few fps depending on the specific application. Part of the issue and part of why I gave up selling them was that they were, more often than not, not just "drop in" kits and required alot of fiddling to fit up properly and other than eliminating some spring twang by insulating the spring, were alot of money for the gain- the price of a Vortek kit vs. stock replacement parts was 2-3:1 meaning someone could replace the stock spring and seals 2-3 times for the same cost as the Vortek kit.

I think, more than anything, alot of people are inclined to read more into things than might be applicable- for example, yes, when installed completely and correctly (not always so easy) a Vortek kit did reduce spring twang and shot cycle vibration- but, for example, just taking apart a gun and doing some very basic 'tune' work such as smoothing out rough edges and using a proper lube might have accounted for more than half of this. I don't recall ever seeing a comparison of someone taking a new rifle, doing a basic tune with stock parts and a proper lube, testing, then installing any of the different aftermarket "kits" and comparing- the comparisons were generally a used rifle with worn parts that had a kit installed- thus showing gains- but it was always my suspicion that the difference between a new rifle tuned and lubed properly vs. an aftermarket "performance kit" were compared, these two states would not be dramatically different. When I got to the point where I could not rationalize the cost of the kits vs. the gains I was seeing and the problems people were encountering with "fit and finish", I decided the kits were not, for me at least, worthwhile to be selling, so I reduced the price on what remained in my stock to match the US pricing, and have let that last stock sell or not sell, but I do not promote them.

_________________
www.scopesandammo.com/storefront



Please note: I do not conduct business through Private Messages (PM's) in online forums. Please do not send a 'PM" with a business-related question.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ruger blackhawk .177
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 11:05 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jul 01, 2009 3:23 pm
Posts: 3067
Location: Northern Ontario
AirGunEric wrote:
As some may recall, I sold Vortek kits actively for a year or two- they do not, generally, output any more power than the stock (full power) parts other than a few fps depending on the specific application. Part of the issue and part of why I gave up selling them was that they were, more often than not, not just "drop in" kits and required alot of fiddling to fit up properly and other than eliminating some spring twang by insulating the spring, were alot of money for the gain- the price of a Vortek kit vs. stock replacement parts was 2-3:1 meaning someone could replace the stock spring and seals 2-3 times for the same cost as the Vortek kit.

I think, more than anything, alot of people are inclined to read more into things than might be applicable- for example, yes, when installed completely and correctly (not always so easy) a Vortek kit did reduce spring twang and shot cycle vibration- but, for example, just taking apart a gun and doing some very basic 'tune' work such as smoothing out rough edges and using a proper lube might have accounted for more than half of this. I don't recall ever seeing a comparison of someone taking a new rifle, doing a basic tune with stock parts and a proper lube, testing, then installing any of the different aftermarket "kits" and comparing- the comparisons were generally a used rifle with worn parts that had a kit installed- thus showing gains- but it was always my suspicion that the difference between a new rifle tuned and lubed properly vs. an aftermarket "performance kit" were compared, these two states would not be dramatically different. When I got to the point where I could not rationalize the cost of the kits vs. the gains I was seeing and the problems people were encountering with "fit and finish", I decided the kits were not, for me at least, worthwhile to be selling, so I reduced the price on what remained in my stock to match the US pricing, and have let that last stock sell or not sell, but I do not promote them.


I went with parts from Eric when I was redoing one for a friend. Vortek cost too much for me.

_________________
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." - Thomas Jefferson.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ruger blackhawk .177
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 11:55 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2013 11:16 pm
Posts: 7
thanks ......the info I believe is more powerful than the fps on the spring kit install. that leaves me with tolerances for shimming the breech seal?????? rule of thumb would be acceptable here I believe. flat washer too thick for example??


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ruger blackhawk .177
PostPosted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:06 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2012 6:32 am
Posts: 966
Location: Montreal
AirGunEric wrote:
As some may recall, I sold Vortek kits actively for a year or two- they do not, generally, output any more power than the stock (full power) parts other than a few fps depending on the specific application. Part of the issue and part of why I gave up selling them was that they were, more often than not, not just "drop in" kits and required alot of fiddling to fit up properly and other than eliminating some spring twang by insulating the spring, were alot of money for the gain- the price of a Vortek kit vs. stock replacement parts was 2-3:1 meaning someone could replace the stock spring and seals 2-3 times for the same cost as the Vortek kit.

I think, more than anything, alot of people are inclined to read more into things than might be applicable- for example, yes, when installed completely and correctly (not always so easy) a Vortek kit did reduce spring twang and shot cycle vibration- but, for example, just taking apart a gun and doing some very basic 'tune' work such as smoothing out rough edges and using a proper lube might have accounted for more than half of this. I don't recall ever seeing a comparison of someone taking a new rifle, doing a basic tune with stock parts and a proper lube, testing, then installing any of the different aftermarket "kits" and comparing- the comparisons were generally a used rifle with worn parts that had a kit installed- thus showing gains- but it was always my suspicion that the difference between a new rifle tuned and lubed properly vs. an aftermarket "performance kit" were compared, these two states would not be dramatically different. When I got to the point where I could not rationalize the cost of the kits vs. the gains I was seeing and the problems people were encountering with "fit and finish", I decided the kits were not, for me at least, worthwhile to be selling, so I reduced the price on what remained in my stock to match the US pricing, and have let that last stock sell or not sell, but I do not promote them.



If you follow any othe Si Pittaway reviews of his Sandwell Field Sports tunes , on Google, you will see that the guns are transformed, not by adding parts but by tweeking the original mechanisms for optimum performance.

That said will not trade my HW97K with 12fp Vortek kit, professionally installed by Len J. for a standard HW97K.

_________________
" Only problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples money"

HW 95 .22 Hawke 3-12x44 , Tuned by Motorhead
HW98 .177 Viper 4-16x50
BSA Ultra .22 MTC Mamba Lite 3-12-44, Regulated and tuned by The Rat Works, UK..


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ruger blackhawk .177
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 12:55 pm 
Offline
Supporting Member 2009
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2006 12:37 am
Posts: 3468
Location: Out There
newlife wrote:
That said will not trade my HW97K with 12fp Vortek kit, professionally installed by Len J. for a standard HW97K.


That was part of the issue, someone with a fairly high degree of skill is typically required to install the kits so they work as intended- they are absolutely not for someone just learning about how to disassemble/reassemble a springer. It is also likely Len did a bit more than just install the kit- if nothing else, he is/was a bit of a perfectionist.

_________________
www.scopesandammo.com/storefront



Please note: I do not conduct business through Private Messages (PM's) in online forums. Please do not send a 'PM" with a business-related question.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ruger blackhawk .177
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 3:01 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2012 6:32 am
Posts: 966
Location: Montreal
AirGunEric wrote:
newlife wrote:
That said will not trade my HW97K with 12fp Vortek kit, professionally installed by Len J. for a standard HW97K.


That was part of the issue, someone with a fairly high degree of skill is typically required to install the kits so they work as intended- they are absolutely not for someone just learning about how to disassemble/reassemble a springer. It is also likely Len did a bit more than just install the kit- if nothing else, he is/was a bit of a perfectionist.


"Having used Len for something else , I agree , a perfectionist.."

_________________
" Only problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples money"

HW 95 .22 Hawke 3-12x44 , Tuned by Motorhead
HW98 .177 Viper 4-16x50
BSA Ultra .22 MTC Mamba Lite 3-12-44, Regulated and tuned by The Rat Works, UK..


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ruger blackhawk .177
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 3:12 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2011 12:29 pm
Posts: 3110
Location: New Brunswick
Y'know I have one of these air rifles plus a Stoeger X5 and a Phantom.
I bet if I dismantled them, cleaned the barrels & spring tubes, polished the triggers I could get extra power, reproducibility and accuracy from them.

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ruger blackhawk .177
PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 9:09 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2013 11:16 pm
Posts: 7
well thanks to all who contributed to my post, i have reviewed the tips and suggestions and have concluded that i just need to upgrade the overall "caliber"(sic) of the air rifle i own. i will continue to play with the blackhawk. I have a few thoughts on my new gun(.177) but will research more thoroughly .....i hope others might heed this. You get what u pay for.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: ruger blackhawk .177
PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 11:34 pm 
Offline
Site Moderator

Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2005 9:25 am
Posts: 3432
Location: Ontario, Canada
I picked up the Ruger BlackHawk Elite which is the same rifle with a different stock (thumbhole style). For $100USd it's a great bargain. The breach seal is about 50 cents at a hardware store or hydraulics shop (Standard #110 size). The trigger is very nice when compared to the direct engagement models from China. Bluing and polish look very acceptable. The scope isn't great but for that price it's fine and functions.

If you have a detuned .177cal version, try shimming the spring with a washer stack on the guide. Post the results if you decide to try out this suggestion.

My BlackHawk does 900fps with 8.4gr JSBs but it's full power from the USA. I still have to lube up the rifle and check accuracy.

Cheers,
Todd


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 22 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
News News Site map Site map SitemapIndex SitemapIndex RSS Feed RSS Feed Channel list Channel list

Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group

phpBB SEO