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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 2:54 am 
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Joined: Sun Jul 28, 2013 8:34 pm
Posts: 1155
Location: Vernon BC
Situation is worse for me! I think 98% of you will think I am overreacting but I need your help. Remember my 3mm by 1mm nick on my new 97 barrel I described before? Well after clumsy (:oops:) application of the Birchwood Casey Presto Pen, I turned it into a 1cm by 1cm mismatched bluing spot. I tried for hours getting it right. Even sanding it off to apply the Super Blue multiple times. The only benefit so far is I buffed out the nick, its smoother now.

Right now, I have it touched up to the best I can, a tad darker than surrounding finish. It slows the OCD gun owner in me. At first I wanted to buy a new one ( :rolleyes:) and try to sell this one at a very competitive price for what it is (not broken, shoots amazing just has a mismatched bluing spot). But after hours & hours of researching, I decided I want to do try something other than the 2 touch-up remedies I tried.

One option is to strip the factory finish and polish to a certain point. What would the best way of protecting the bare metal be in this form? I really want a STL 97KT but can only find a .177 here in Canada. This may be a way to "get" one. Has anyone tried this? Maybe strip, polish, clear coat? Or something better? This is an airgun not a firearm, so high heat is not a concern?

Second option is to just strip & polish just the exposed barrel and cold blue so atleast its even without the blotch of mismatched bluing thats there now.

Third option is pending. I asked one gunsmith in the Vancouver area if they can hot blue my air rifle. "We don't work on airguns, you can try D&L" was their reply. WTH?! So I am waiting on a reply from another one based in Prince George. Yes I would pay $200+ for a hot blue on the 97. Better than factory, and some of them look insane!! (Find on youtube- Custom HW98 V Mach+GinB stock by The Ghostmaker/CountryPursuitsTV, his looks so awesome). So hopefully this place gets back to me.

Fourth option is one I'm not happy with. But If all else fails, no gunsmith, too chicken to strip & polish & protect the gun, then I have to learn to accept. And live with it. Maybe wrap a piece of electrical tape there to hide it :lol:.

Well I'm hoping someone can tell me more about option 1. Option 2 is straight forward, option 3 i'm hoping for. Option 4 is lame. Sorry for the really long post, this is driving me nuts though. I figured I would try to ask all you fine folks. I browsed and browsed different gun forums to ask, they all seem so out of date?

Thanks for taking the time to read and besides live with it, what would you do, or what do you know of option 1 or 3? Any gunsmiths you know that will hot blue an airgun?


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 7:52 am 
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Location: Stavely, Alberta
Cerakote is also an option. Many gun manufacturers use it. It is a 2 pack type paint that is baked on. I am just about to apply their Stainless Steel finish to one of my pieces. Evrything I've read or seen (youtube) about the product has been very positive.

I understand where your gunsmith is coming from with his "I don't work on Airguns" responce. I am a qualified Gunsmith with plenty of work and I also don't repair Airguns.

You asked for suggestions to touch up the scratch in a previous post and I suggested Oxpho Blue. I have used this product many times and have certainly found it to be about the best of any of the cold bluing products I have ever used. I have never had any luck using Birchwood Casey bluing products

DaveD :D

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 10:12 am 
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Posts: 14
Hey!

I'm no gunsmith or anything like that. I did brought back 3 airguns recently though, and the main part of the job was to restaure the metal parts. Living in a country where gunsmiths are not abundant (Portugal) because with our gun laws they're all dying little by little, I had to do with what I could find.

I've used the ballistol blueing solution. It works wonderfull and I think you can pretty much match any shade, it depends on how patient you are (and how many times you'll repeat the procedure!).

My advice is, if the patch is darker now, try using a very very fine (the finest there is) steel wool to gently polish that spot (be carefull not to polilsh the factory blueing). This is a work of love as it is quite time and patience consuming!

If it doesn't work, I'd recomend the ballistol product. I've tried a gel one and it was a mess! It came out full of blotches! This ballistol one worked great (I promise I'm not the sales rep of this thing! ;) ).

Don't take out the factory blueing as it's the best finish you can get (other than the hot blueing by a gunsmith).

Anyway, I don't get why your gunsmith wouldn't work on your airgun. As long as you pay the price... there shouldn't be an issue. May it's just a "not noble enough gun" kind of thing... Eh eh eh eh

Hope it helps

Cheers

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 11:41 am 
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Location: Vernon BC
Thanks Dave and GCA. Its too bad some gunsmiths won't hot blue my "firearm" (according to our law). On more than a few websites they show there bluing results on much cheaper & uglier firearms than the 97 :roll: I'll check that Cerakote out and oxpho-blue & ballistol. Looking more & more like option 4. Any other equivalent to cerakote? I may only just want to do the barrel/under-lever? Thanks again for your guys' help.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 12:20 pm 
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Location: Stavely, Alberta
M3ga3T wrote:
Thanks Dave and GCA. Its too bad some gunsmiths won't hot blue my "firearm" (according to our law). On more than a few websites they show there bluing results on much cheaper & uglier firearms than the 97 :roll: I'll check that Cerakote out and oxpho-blue & ballistol. Looking more & more like option 4. Any other equivalent to cerakote? I may only just want to do the barrel/under-lever? Thanks again for your guys' help.


The equipment to carry out Hot bluing is expensive. Brownells show a starter set for $2000. Supplys are pretty pricey and Brownells nor any of the other US suppliers will ship to Canada as far as I know. Add to that the amount of space required for the various tanks and heaters etc. and it's easy to see why gunsmiths are reluctant to get into the process.

You know, this could be a perfect business opportunity for you. Set up a Hot Bluing business and I'm sure there would be no shortage of customers :lol:

Duracote :?: is an alternative to Ceracote I believe.

DaveD :D

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 6:50 pm 
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Location: Toronto
http://www.cerakoteguncoatings.com/

my friend who is set up for vapour blasting is starting to do this for engire parts and is going to test out on a few of my guns.

I will post before, almost and after pictures. from pre blasted to coated.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 8:52 pm 
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Posts: 231
Location: England.
Sounds like some of the supposed gunsmiths have a bee in their bonnet, mind we have a few over here who look down on air guns.

Hot blacking/rusting/browning/blueing call it what you want is a rusting process.
Degreaser and bags of salts readily available for little money circa £120
Two steel tanks and a thermometer about £50
Heater easily made about £5
Total cost about half the price of a cheap spring gun.

Preparation is the key often given to the apprentices who in turn do the blacking.
To do the preparation could literally be 5 mins to 50 hours, who knows, it depends what finish you want. The finer the finish the more flaws stand out and endlessly have to start again.
To give you some idea 19 years ago it took me a solid 2 1/2 days with a 10" industrial polishing mop to get a show grade finish on a TX that would make above mentioned name video look like a Crossman. To strip and finish to standard of the HW97 about 20 to 30 mins.

Prices fully done over here from £40 complete air rifle to around £80 for a good job. Show finish impossible to price, it takes as long as it takes and no company will undertake.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 12:10 am 
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Joined: Sun Jul 28, 2013 8:34 pm
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Location: Vernon BC
Well I stripped just the barrel and polished. Looks decent to me. A guy on another forum suggested trewax buffed in to help coat if I don't have access to anything better. I didn't give it a super polish but wth. I don't know what to do anymore. The other gunsmith I emailed still hasn't got back to me. I don't get why the first one shut me down. They obviously have the equipment to hot blue. They have prices for different finishes. Oh well.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 12:34 am 
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Location: Stavely, Alberta
M3ga3T wrote:
Well I stripped just the barrel and polished. Looks decent to me. A guy on another forum suggested trewax buffed in to help coat if I don't have access to anything better. I didn't give it a super polish but wth. I don't know what to do anymore. The other gunsmith I emailed still hasn't got back to me. I don't get why the first one shut me down. They obviously have the equipment to hot blue. They have prices for different finishes. Oh well.


If I had the equipment to do the job, I'd be right on it buddy. I hate to turn any work away, Ever. My missus keeps on at me to build a bigger shop and get more equipment but I am a little reluctant to do so as I live in a rural area with a limited catchment area.

DaveD :D

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 12:53 am 
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Joined: Sun Jul 28, 2013 8:34 pm
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Location: Vernon BC
Thanks for the offer though Dave. I hear what you are saying. Would you recommend sending my 97 of to get polished? How would you recommend protecting the bare metal? IDK if I like the wax idea.

I would like the stainless look somehow. Not chromed/super shiny a bit duller. It took me forever to do just the barrel! To 400 grit.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:31 am 
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Joined: Sun Jul 28, 2013 8:34 pm
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Location: Vernon BC
There is no way in hell I can finish stripping & polishing my whole rifle by hand :| I may look into selling this AG, fund a new one, If I get bad news from the gunsmith tomorrow. So I guess keep an eye out for a 97 for a lowball price OBO.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 10:44 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2005 11:55 am
Posts: 231
Location: England.
You could have it nickel plated but block up certain threads and holes else it wont go back together.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 10:57 am 
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Location: Vernon BC
Thats true. How would you go about doing that?


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 11:11 am 
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Location: England.
Just look up various companies that do nickel and copper plating.

It will need a high finish before copper plated then nickel plated. Any imperfection will show so would need a proper mop polish on the HW.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 11:14 am 
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Find a place that does Nickel plating...But, Jon is in England we are in Canada, there is much less of everything over here unfortunately so price will be a factor for sure, not to mention; how many of these place know anything about guns? Im guessing not a lot of them...


I was going to recommend leaving it alone and just shooting the gun as it could turn into a much bigger issue that will cost much more time & money than a 1mm x 3mm imperfection is worth IMO I have reblued entire guns using cold blue, but to get a decent finish the part must be polished extensively and then given many coats of blue. It doesn't look as good as hot bluing, but can still look good when done right.

The biggest issue is that now you have a stripped barrel that will be next to impossible to "rematch" to the action of the gun without stripping everything down, all for a 1mm x 3mm spec out of the bluing...Im not sure, but I am guessing that if a nick that small bothered you, having the barrel a different shade of black than the rest of the gun will be even worse for you. The HW bluing is not nearly as nice as AA's bluing, but it would still be hard replicate exactly.

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