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 Post subject: Daisy 717 / 747 pistols
PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 7:23 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 10:32 pm
Posts: 758
Location: Burlington ON
They look a bit plasticky, any good though? There is no dovetail for a scope as far as I can tell, correct?


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 10:37 pm 
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Location: Ontario, Canada
I had a couple of the 717 pistols. They shot about the same velocity as the P3, HW40, P17 series. The grips, rear sight, bolt and trigger blade are plastic. The frame is pot metal. You can mount optics using the B-Square model 17900 (IZH-46) scope mount on the barrel.

I find the 717 to be a bit clunky when compared to the HW40 style.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2016 11:00 pm 
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Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2014 9:14 pm
Posts: 663
Location: Mississauga, ON
I just got a 747 a couple of weeks ago. It's now my favourite pistol to shoot. I had just got a Cometa Indian a couple of weeks before that and though I like it well enough I find it much harder to get decent groups with, probably because it's a springer. I'm comparing to the Indian because I see you have one.

I find the 747 is extremely accurate, and my eyes are not the best with iron sights. I only shoot in my basement at a distance of 28 feet, though. Keep in mind that the difference between the 717 and 747 is that the 747 has a Lothar Walther barrel and an adjustable rear sight (plastic). The 747 is just very slightly harder to pump than the Indian, but MUCH easier than a P17. The 747 Chrony's at about 360 fps whereas the Indian is about 480 fps. As one member here commented, it makes about as much noise as a mouse fart. I wouldn't hesitate to shoot it in my basement all night.

There are no scope rails but as mentioned you can get a clamp-on-barrel mount that is supposed to work. I will probably look into this at some future date. There are a few plastic parts, but the gun feels solid enough to me. I like it a lot!

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Daisy 953 * QB78D * Walther 1894 * Beretta CX4 & PX4 * Zoraki HP01 * Beeman P17 * Walther CP88 Comp. * Crosman 1377/2240/SA6/357-8
Swiss Arms P92 * Colt Commander 1911 * Walther PPK * P08 * Colt Python 357 * TW 1911/Limited * S&W M&P R8


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 1:33 am 
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Location: Ontario, Canada
More good points on the Daisy 717:

- Piston seal is a common plumbing o-ring. Cheap at hardware store.
- Bolt already has probe
- Trigger engagement can easily be shimmed to give a crisp let-off
- Accurate shooting pistol
- Grip has a nice wide thumbrest
- Adjustable piston length
- I think parts are available from Daisy-USA for cheap
- Very quiet
- One of mine clocked at just over 400 fps with 7.3gr JSB Match pellets

Image

Image


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 1:54 am 
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Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2015 9:12 am
Posts: 1034
Location: Hamilton
Been meaning to try mine out?

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 8:46 am 
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Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 10:32 pm
Posts: 758
Location: Burlington ON
ejackyou wrote:
Been meaning to try mine out?

Not another one sitting in the box waiting for a test run?! :wink:

Thanks all for the input, could be an option, especially with that scope mount. A quick search shows it listed on places like Amazon, unavailable though but I guess it can be had from somewhere. Can't find anything on Ebay, surprisingly - though I guess there's not enough demand to warrant a string of knock-offs.

Back to the pistol, does the Daisy have enough oomph to knock down field targets at 20-30 yards or so? I am thinking of dabbling with a pneumatic for that but options are limited when looking for the possiblity to mount a scope or dot. I had a HW40 years ago and I know that is do-able but not ideal because of the way it cocks and how the top snaps down. Same with the Alecto, though I have seen people get good results with a dot sight on them. They are expensive and hard to find now though.
Other options are the Crosman 1701P (also expensive, hard to find and needs a pump or tank which I don't have - I like springers as you can see...), 2240/mod (CO2 too temperature variable), 1377/mod (decent option with steel breech and piston mod that takes 3 or 4 pumps off the number needed but would still prefer a single stroke).

lleader - the Indian is a bit rough around the edges but I like mine a lot. Of the ones I have / have tried, the grips make it feel the best in the hand, it's quite compact, can be cocked (cranked?) with one finger and thumb and has a reasonable whack. I don't really "collect" and was thinking of selling it when I bought the Hatsan 25 off our late friend here but decided I couldn't part with it when it came to a final garage test...


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 9:52 am 
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Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2008 12:20 pm
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Location: Edmonton
Maybe if your targets are made out of cardboard ;)
The 717/747 are meant to be at their best at about 10yds...they were designed as informal plinking target pistols.
They launch a lightweight pellet (7.0 gr RWS work very well) at only about 350fps.
I have the Gamo Compact, one of the 747 main competitors, with about the same specs.
At 10m it competition accurate.
I've tried plinking outdoors at 25 yards.
Indoors at 10m it will put 5 pellets in nearly the same hole.
At 25yds outdoor, even with a gentle breeze hitting a pop can (for example) is dicey, and when it does it barely moves it.
Your experience with one of the Daisy's would be the same.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 10:38 am 
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Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 10:32 pm
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Location: Burlington ON
Interesting bob, I have seen others using "proper" match pistols but the spec on those is higher velocity, 450 to 495 or so fps. It seems you might be narrowing my options down to a 1377 project... I was just watching a YouTube video review in German where the two were compared and the reviewer claimed the build quality was better with the Daisy.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 11:35 am 
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Location: Ontario, Canada
The Daisy 717/747 were once a popular silhouette pistol but those distances only go to 18 yards. You can still find some good articles and pics online.

http://www.citlink.net/~schattler/amc.htm
http://www.airguns.net/reviews_daisy747.php

I have tested velocity on at least 4 Daisy 7X7 pistols. The slowest was an older 777 that only did 340fps with pistol weight pellets. The highest was my beat up 717 that was assembled from two broken pistols. On that pistol I used a metric o-ring on the valve body that was thicker than the regular standard seal. It was a tight fit but bumped up velocity to slightly over 400fps with the light JSBs. The other two 717s that I tested were around 365-380 fps with 7.0 to 7.9 gr pellets. The 7X7 pistol has a small valve space and is not know for speed but they usually shoot accurately and quietly. The very mild cocking effort is sweet too.

http://www.pilkguns.com/tenp/spd747.htm


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 5:10 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 10:32 pm
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Location: Burlington ON
Interesting links, thanks.
If not what I am looking for to reach out to 25 yards or so, it still looks like an entertaining option for a bit of quiet, indoor winter shooting.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2016 7:32 pm 
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....My 747 is the 'go to' pistol for target shooting....It's designed and built for accuracy at 10m. so no need for higher power or optics ... It's just not designed for that (even though 400+ would be nice)......I find it a very nice pistol to hold and shoot, BUT....when it comes to shooting rats at under 15' I use the P17 just because it has a bit more punch.....Are there any other single stroke side/under lever pneumatic pistols out there? .... I may try a 'metric' O ring on the 747...and I'd like to have 2 O rings on the P17 piston (any takers on doing that for me?)


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 10:12 am 
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Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 10:32 pm
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Location: Burlington ON
A question to those with experience of both: would you be inclined to go 717/747 or HW40 (or P17/P3 or whatever it is)?
I know what the HW40 is like but don't have a comparison myself yet with the Daisy pistols. If they are worth scoping, I would have though they can do more than just 10m or so but I don't know, that velocity spec is a bit low. TC's gets up around 400 fps though.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 10:48 am 
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Location: Edmonton
DDtank wrote:
Interesting links, thanks.
If not what I am looking for to reach out to 25 yards or so, it still looks like an entertaining option for a bit of quiet, indoor winter shooting.


Bingo.
During the summer my Gamo Compact sees no use whatsoever.
But come winter, and it's -20c (as it has been in Alberta since the beginning of Dec) and it sees nearly daily use in my basement range.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 10:56 am 
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Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2015 9:12 am
Posts: 1034
Location: Hamilton
If Your aiming at beyond 10 meters, I'd go more for the IZH or better yet the Beeman P1 or P11 from Airgun source, or perhaps
an alecto .22 with longer .177 barrel?
Sounds like your contemplating illegal territory with 75 ft with a handgun in mind?

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A Whole Bunch of Handguns!
C02, SPRINGER, Pneumatic, Most new, some Vintage, a few Airsoft?
More Vintage!


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 11:28 am 
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Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 10:32 pm
Posts: 758
Location: Burlington ON
ejackyou wrote:
Sounds like your contemplating illegal territory with 75 ft with a handgun in mind?

Not at all. We did a FT air pistol shoot at the Burlington range a couple of weeks ago and there are more coming up. The rules give suggested distances of 20-25 m. As you know, I like my springers and I may just perservere with the HW45. I know that has the power for 25m but what I don't know is how much to hold over/under at different distances as all I have is 21 ft in the garage to practice with. I also tried scoping it but it looked and felt terrible so will stick with open sights. Anyway, this is why I am exploring what is out there by way of a pneumatic with the option of taking a dot sight or scope (and doesn't break the bank!) as that is what most seem to use.


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