Canadian Airgun Forum

The #1 Community for Airguns in Canada!
It is currently Tue Nov 12, 2019 1:34 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours


The Canadian Airgun Forums are a place for people to discuss and learn about airguns and the airgunning sport in Canada. There are lots of discussions about airguns, airgun accessories, reviews, modification and repair information, airgun events, field target and free classifieds!

 

You need to register before you can post: click the register link to proceed. Before you register, please read the forum rules. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload your own pictures, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple, and absolutely free! To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.








Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 19 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2017 11:30 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2016 3:24 pm
Posts: 106
Location: Sidney Bc, Canada
Hey folks.i recently got a good deal on a lightly used.22 Crosman quest. After doing some research on the gun I decided it probably wasn't worth it to convert it to the nitro piston for the money. Started looking into a vortek spring but I don't know (nor have the tools required to measure) the spring that I need to order. If some one could point me in the right direction it'd be greatly appreciated.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2017 12:41 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon May 26, 2014 1:08 am
Posts: 480
Location: Thunder Bay
I have a vortek docile spring in a Ruger. It's a good spring. IMHO, stock crosman springs are an excellent sproing for the money. The PAL rated or non-pal rated springs are around $14 from gravel agency. By the time you get a spring from vortek in the US, the bill will be pushing $50. The only reason I tried the vortek was that I could not find a stock spring in Canada at the time. All my tuned crosmans use stock springs.
No need to worry about spring length with a stock spring.

_________________
12 springers and a couple of pumpers.
2 lathes and lots of scrap metal.

I'm not multitasking. I'm doing something else until I remember what I was doing.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 8:23 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 9:16 pm
Posts: 1271
Location: United States
They don't really make an ideal drop in spring for that gun, at least not that I'm aware of.
They make several that will fit, the one that drops in is very weak, the others are too big for the oem guide so you'd need to deal with the noise or fixing it.
I forget the # of the good fitting weak one but it was ~.730(OD) x .120(wire) x 35(coils), so part # would be ~730120-35. I think it cost me ~30% power over a new oem spring.
The next size up would be 780125 w/35.5 coils.
Next is 790128 and 34.8.
Those are the coil #'s I rec'd when I requested max length, so that could be all you get or maybe they're random or who knows.
So the oem fits great, is cheap, and when new makes about as much power as is reasonable. Beyond a certain point, and I think that's it, spring strength nets less and less power but negative drawbacks get worse and worse.
I said "new" which is because the chinese oem springs will take a set more so than quality springs and by how much varies quite a bit. So with the Vortek you get much better quality, but have to deal the drawbacks of power or fit.
Maccari is another source but they don't list dimensions or strength so who knows what fits what. There's another place in the UK? Titan springs, but also little to no spec info.
Btw I didn't know a Vortek ended up being so much to get to CA! Wth? One more reason to get the oem unit.
As a side note; the NP2 spring is substantially cheaper than the other gas springs, and while it's way too strong for that gun I think the weaker 500fps spring might be a nice match. So one way or another I hoping someone will try so we'll know if has the right strength. It's a little bit shorter than the normal nitro so it would just need a little shimming, which if done per the conversion pix I posted here somewhere it should be super easy. My guess is the weaker NP2 would be $16CA, but I don't have the part #.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 10:26 pm 
Offline
Site Moderator

Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2005 9:25 am
Posts: 3432
Location: Ontario, Canada
The Vortek web site appears to indicate they will make a spring to whatever spec you want, within reason. You could duplicate the OEM size (Crosman Quest) but have higher quality.
http://vortekproducts.com/ourstore/airgun%20Springs


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 7:56 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon May 26, 2014 1:08 am
Posts: 480
Location: Thunder Bay
A vortek spring costs about $19 US. Shipping in USA is about $8. Shipping to Canada is around $20, so you are pushing $40 US (over $50 CDN with exchange). If you're lucky, you won't get another "brokerage" fee from UPS. The vortek is a good high quality spring. Is it worth the cost to get it to Canada? In my opinion, only if nothing is available in Canada (as was my case) or you want a custom spring.
Is the vortek worth the premium price? Yes. It is made of premium steel and finished to a much better finish than a stock spring. It's the shipping to Canada that makes it cost prohibitive.

Small rant: I have been subjected to seemingly random "brokerage fees" from UPS/FedEx on items shipped from USA to Canada. I live close to the border so I ship to a USA border store now and drive there to pick it up. Never a problem at the border, on either side. In deference to ups/FedEx, there may be hst/duty that must be collected and forwarded to the appropriate govt agency, and that costs staff time.

Just my $0.02 (CDN).

_________________
12 springers and a couple of pumpers.
2 lathes and lots of scrap metal.

I'm not multitasking. I'm doing something else until I remember what I was doing.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 11:19 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2016 3:24 pm
Posts: 106
Location: Sidney Bc, Canada
Thanks for all the info guys. After checking around I'll just go with the Crosman OEM spring. I'm only looking for 800-900fps and the rifle is rated for 1000fps I believe. I haven't shot many spring rifles. I own 1, and one NPS, but all the others are MSP or SSP or co2 . I assume it's going to be like shooting the industry b3 except worse hahaha. The Crosman OEM spring is only about 16.00$ from gravel, I'm sure I'll pay at least another 15 to ship from QC to BC but what can you do.. the Optimus should end up being a nice little ratter..


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 5:13 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 9:16 pm
Posts: 1271
Location: United States
Vortek will make custom lengths to a point. I was not able to get the lengths I wanted.
I don't know about ID, but when I told them the one with the correct ID was far too weak, the only solution they had was one with a larger ID. So my guess is they have X sizes premade and precut, then all you can have is those cut a little shorter. Maybe if you beg or pay a custom premium they can make a better one, or maybe they simply cannot, all depends on what machines they have there.
The oem spring is a very good match for the gun so I'd do that, and if you're happy with 8-900 then it should last forever, as long as it doesn't have a defect causing a break, but by making a spring sheath and/or using spring tar you will no doubt greatly reduce the odds of breakage. I've never broken a spring. That sheath or tar greatly reduces the annoying noise which is why I do it.
It'll be equal to or better than the B3, and I think better in every way.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2017 9:47 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri May 25, 2012 5:41 pm
Posts: 56
Location: Amherstburg Ontario
I believe that gun will take the E3650 spring from air rifle headquarters and Jim ships to Canada

_________________
RWS 34 .177 Vortek PG2 kit
RWS 34 .22 ARH kit
Remington Express .177
FlyingDragon .177 xs12


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 4:23 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2007 7:56 pm
Posts: 173
Location: Sidney, BC.
So have you taken it apart to see what your dealing with?
Maybe nothing wrong with the spring....maybe just needs a new piston or filling in the hole ?.....Do you have a chrony to check the speeds?
KEN.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 6:30 am 
Offline
Supporting Member 2009

Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2005 1:41 pm
Posts: 997
Location: GTA
ricksplace wrote:
A vortek spring costs about $19 US. Shipping in USA is about $8. Shipping to Canada is around $20, so you are pushing $40 US (over $50 CDN with exchange). If you're lucky, you won't get another "brokerage" fee from UPS. The vortek is a good high quality spring. Is it worth the cost to get it to Canada? In my opinion, only if nothing is available in Canada (as was my case) or you want a custom spring.
Is the vortek worth the premium price? Yes. It is made of premium steel and finished to a much better finish than a stock spring. It's the shipping to Canada that makes it cost prohibitive.

Small rant: I have been subjected to seemingly random "brokerage fees" from UPS/FedEx on items shipped from USA to Canada. I live close to the border so I ship to a USA border store now and drive there to pick it up. Never a problem at the border, on either side. In deference to ups/FedEx, there may be hst/duty that must be collected and forwarded to the appropriate govt agency, and that costs staff time.

Just my $0.02 (CDN).



If you ship with USPS there is generally no brokerage fees, I've never paid them. I think USPS is actually cheaper a well, and comes via Canada Post, no having to go to the courier depot if you miss he delivery person.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 1:35 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon May 26, 2014 1:08 am
Posts: 480
Location: Thunder Bay
Woody wrote:
ricksplace wrote:
A vortek spring costs about $19 US. Shipping in USA is about $8. Shipping to Canada is around $20, so you are pushing $40 US (over $50 CDN with exchange). If you're lucky, you won't get another "brokerage" fee from UPS. The vortek is a good high quality spring. Is it worth the cost to get it to Canada? In my opinion, only if nothing is available in Canada (as was my case) or you want a custom spring.
Is the vortek worth the premium price? Yes. It is made of premium steel and finished to a much better finish than a stock spring. It's the shipping to Canada that makes it cost prohibitive.

Small rant: I have been subjected to seemingly random "brokerage fees" from UPS/FedEx on items shipped from USA to Canada. I live close to the border so I ship to a USA border store now and drive there to pick it up. Never a problem at the border, on either side. In deference to ups/FedEx, there may be hst/duty that must be collected and forwarded to the appropriate govt agency, and that costs staff time.

Just my $0.02 (CDN).



If you ship with USPS there is generally no brokerage fees, I've never paid them. I think USPS is actually cheaper a well, and comes via Canada Post, no having to go to the courier depot if you miss he delivery person.


This is good advice. I have never had a problem with USPS either.

_________________
12 springers and a couple of pumpers.
2 lathes and lots of scrap metal.

I'm not multitasking. I'm doing something else until I remember what I was doing.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 8:17 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2016 3:24 pm
Posts: 106
Location: Sidney Bc, Canada
I haven't actually taken it apart to see if is the spring or the piston head. I imagine that would be a pretty solid idea KEN, would be more than practical idea.. Either way, the spring is on it's way at some point or another, and after doing a little research I discovered it was detuned both via a longer piston and a weaker spring, so I will do some investigation in regard to the piston head and see what I can see! Thank you for the help and information guys. Always a pleasure.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2017 5:55 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2016 7:33 pm
Posts: 240
Location: Yukon
ricksplace wrote:
A vortek spring costs about $19 US. Shipping in USA is about $8. Shipping to Canada is around $20, so you are pushing $40 US (over $50 CDN with exchange). If you're lucky, you won't get another "brokerage" fee from UPS. The vortek is a good high quality spring. Is it worth the cost to get it to Canada? In my opinion, only if nothing is available in Canada (as was my case) or you want a custom spring.
Is the vortek worth the premium price? Yes. It is made of premium steel and finished to a much better finish than a stock spring. It's the shipping to Canada that makes it cost prohibitive.

Small rant: I have been subjected to seemingly random "brokerage fees" from UPS/FedEx on items shipped from USA to Canada. I live close to the border so I ship to a USA border store now and drive there to pick it up. Never a problem at the border, on either side. In deference to ups/FedEx, there may be hst/duty that must be collected and forwarded to the appropriate govt agency, and that costs staff time.

Just my $0.02 (CDN).


Let me add my 2 cents also. Complete rip off of the Canadian consumers. Unfortunately when i order from China off Ebay..............no custom fees, brokerage fees or taxes. And we even don't have a signed "free trade" deal either.
Add to that Amazon Canada is simply a dumping ground for stuff either too old or simply rejected by their US customers. If you try to order from Amazon USA they wont ship to Canada half the time. Rant over. Set up some new targets


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2017 6:07 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2016 7:33 pm
Posts: 240
Location: Yukon
Darkstar wrote:
I haven't actually taken it apart to see if is the spring or the piston head. I imagine that would be a pretty solid idea KEN, would be more than practical idea.. Either way, the spring is on it's way at some point or another, and after doing a little research I discovered it was detuned both via a longer piston and a weaker spring, so I will do some investigation in regard to the piston head and see what I can see! Thank you for the help and information guys. Always a pleasure.


I tried installing a 3/4 inch long copper tube behind my spring on my Quest 500 but it wouldn't cock the trigger. So I tore it down further and found the 150mm piston (short?) with the small hole drilled into its face. So do I assume I have the quest 1000 spring or was the piston drilled AND a weaker spring used by the factory to de-tune the rifle?

Many in here seem to be ordering a full power spring but have the long piston without a hole. This would make your up-springed rifle still less powerful that a US version no? To go full power the short piston and the full power spring would be required or am I missing something.

Also I believe Chevota somewhere in here suggested that a full power stock spring for the .22 and the full power stock .177 spring would have different part numbers or are different springs? Please clarify this for me.

I find it interesting/curious that there is less than 1 inch of pr-load on the retention spring. Any school girl could assemble without a compressor.

Thanks in Advance
tango


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2017 10:42 pm 
Offline
Site Moderator

Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2005 9:25 am
Posts: 3432
Location: Ontario, Canada
Hi tango... Read through the postings about my detuned .177cal Optimus. It's basically the same rifle as the Quest. Mine has the 170mm piston with no vent hole. It started with a very light .098" 34 coil spring that shot right at 500fps with 7.9gr pellets. I installed a .118" 33 coil spring last night and velocity bumped up to 745fps. I'm looking for 600-625fps so I plan to reduce the guide spacer from 1.5" down to 1/4" or 1/2".

I also have a full power U.S. spec Optimus (150mm piston). It has the .122" 36 coil spring. As a new rifle, it was shooting the 7.9gr at 960fps. I removed the 1.5" spacer and installed a 3/8" and velocity dropped to a sweet 800fps (almost no preload). A lighter wire spring would be needed to go lower.

A 150mm piston, with plugged vent hole, should do over 900fps with a fresh .122" 36 coil spring (.177cal).


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 19 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
News News Site map Site map SitemapIndex SitemapIndex RSS Feed RSS Feed Channel list Channel list

Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group

phpBB SEO