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PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:47 am 
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Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2014 10:49 am
Posts: 243
Location: QC
Trying to wrap my head around some specifics of the new legislation, the SIAF Website lists the following requirements to register a non-restricted firearm:

Quote:
the brand;
the model;
the length of the barrel (Watch the video capsule titled Measuring the length of a firearm);
the mechanism;
the type;
the calibre;
the serial number of the firearm;
if the firearm does not have a serial number, any other number affixed to or placed on the firearm for the purpose of identifying it, e.g. the number of the self-adhesive label provided by the federal government at the time of the Canadian Firearms Registry and still affixed to the firearm;
if the firearm has already been registered, its unique firearm number (UFAN);
the place where the firearm is kept.


If say a PAL owning individual was to manufacture a PAL rated air rifle from scratch, what would the registration procedure be? The FAQ section did not yield any answers.

What about a sub 500 fps air gun being tuned to fire at higher velocity, at what point should it be registered? What if it is then de-tuned?


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 7:56 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2017 7:06 pm
Posts: 846
Location: Meaford, Ont.
PZAM wrote:
Trying to wrap my head around some specifics of the new legislation, the SIAF Website lists the following requirements to register a non-restricted firearm:

Quote:
the brand;
the model;
the length of the barrel (Watch the video capsule titled Measuring the length of a firearm);
the mechanism;
the type;
the calibre;
the serial number of the firearm;
if the firearm does not have a serial number, any other number affixed to or placed on the firearm for the purpose of identifying it, e.g. the number of the self-adhesive label provided by the federal government at the time of the Canadian Firearms Registry and still affixed to the firearm;
if the firearm has already been registered, its unique firearm number (UFAN);
the place where the firearm is kept.


If say a PAL owning individual was to manufacture a PAL rated air rifle from scratch, what would the registration procedure be? The FAQ section did not yield any answers.

What about a sub 500 fps air gun being tuned to fire at higher velocity, at what point should it be registered? What if it is then de-tuned?

Over 500FPS and 4.2 foot pounds has to be registered. Once registered I don't see them ever unregistering them. Prime example I was found not guilty of a charge years ago and I got pulled over a couple days later and cop came backup to my car and asked me how I beat the charge. What does that tell you?


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:56 am 
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Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2012 10:11 am
Posts: 322
Location: Near Montreal, Quebec
PZAM:
Don't hesitate to call the Quebec office managing the Registration. If you have a valid PAL you have already gotten an email from them inviting you to register before January 29, 2019 and the phone number is in their message. Otherwise Google. You will get the right answer and unbiased information to your concern.
I have called them to get information on the 'types of firearm' that are not described on the Forms and they were very helpful. (en français évidemment).
I know it's a pain but it's not any worse than what it was when the Canadian Registry was in force and having to register our PAL rated airgun rifles.

Hawk-i

_________________
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Weihrauch HW77 Sp Ed .22
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KRAL Puncher .177
S.A.G AR2078-B Match .177
Weihrauch HW50S .117
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'HAVE GUN. WILL SHOOT'


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:07 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 7:23 am
Posts: 2818
Location: Somewheres near the Atlantic
Hawk-I wrote:
PZAM:
Don't hesitate to call the Quebec office managing the Registration. If you have a valid PAL you have already gotten an email from them inviting you to register before January 29, 2019 and the phone number is in their message. Otherwise Google. You will get the right answer and unbiased information to your concern.
I have called them to get information on the 'types of firearm' that are not described on the Forms and they were very helpful. (en français évidemment).
I know it's a pain but it's not any worse than what it was when the Canadian Registry was in force and having to register our PAL rated airgun rifles.

Hawk-i


But I believe you will. Technically PAL rated are firearms in the CC. If they make you registered non restricted. That will include PAL rated. Now I say Its BS.. All the information about the registry was suppose to be destroyed. Court ordered. And I dunno how federally they are allowing this? No Offense to Quebec people that love it there. But that Quebec and Ontario are just their own counties.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:49 am 
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Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2012 10:11 am
Posts: 322
Location: Near Montreal, Quebec
What the Quebec Registry is attempting to do with ALL PAL rated firearms - and yes...PAL rated airguns... is emulate what the Federal Government had in force as a firearms control measure. Airguns that are +500fps fall into the category:firearms….and it's not the 'either/or' issue of FPE of any kind.
I was told by the QPP agent that the only information that Quebec obtained from the Fed Reg. program was whatever was on file only for names-address- email that was active at the time the Fed Registry was shut down.

There was concern that ALL firearms in Quebec were going to be 'controlled' with a specific Licence number engraved on the firearm. That is no longer the case or the intention. Each firearm has a specific Serial number and that is what is registered. Same when the Fed Reg was in force. None serialized firearms do need to be inspected and issued an Individual Identification Number that is affixed (permanent sticker)to the firearm in Quebec province according the new 'registry law' in effect.

Listen, I don't like the idea either and I'm not attempting to minimize that 'intrusion' to my private affairs with how many and of what type of 'guns' I own that are in my home. (powderburners or airguns). Luckily rest of Canada including NS are exempt of such law.
Hawk-i


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 12:36 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2017 7:06 pm
Posts: 846
Location: Meaford, Ont.
leadslinger wrote:
Hawk-I wrote:
PZAM:
Don't hesitate to call the Quebec office managing the Registration. If you have a valid PAL you have already gotten an email from them inviting you to register before January 29, 2019 and the phone number is in their message. Otherwise Google. You will get the right answer and unbiased information to your concern.
I have called them to get information on the 'types of firearm' that are not described on the Forms and they were very helpful. (en français évidemment).
I know it's a pain but it's not any worse than what it was when the Canadian Registry was in force and having to register our PAL rated airgun rifles.

Hawk-i


But I believe you will. Technically PAL rated are firearms in the CC. If they make you registered non restricted. That will include PAL rated. Now I say Its BS.. All the information about the registry was suppose to be destroyed. Court ordered. And I dunno how federally they are allowing this? No Offense to Quebec people that love it there. But that Quebec and [b]Ontario are just their own counties.[/b]

HEY HEY! Nice and warm, sun shining here in the Banana belt. How is the weather out there? :lol:


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 12:42 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 7:23 am
Posts: 2818
Location: Somewheres near the Atlantic
Hawk-I wrote:
What the Quebec Registry is attempting to do with ALL PAL rated firearms - and yes...PAL rated airguns... is emulate what the Federal Government had in force as a firearms control measure. Airguns that are +500fps fall into the category:firearms….and it's not the 'either/or' issue of FPE of any kind.
I was told by the QPP agent that the only information that Quebec obtained from the Fed Reg. program was whatever was on file only for names-address- email that was active at the time the Fed Registry was shut down.

There was concern that ALL firearms in Quebec were going to be 'controlled' with a specific Licence number engraved on the firearm. That is no longer the case or the intention. Each firearm has a specific Serial number and that is what is registered. Same when the Fed Reg was in force. None serialized firearms do need to be inspected and issued an Individual Identification Number that is affixed (permanent sticker)to the firearm in Quebec province according the new 'registry law' in effect.

Listen, I don't like the idea either and I'm not attempting to minimize that 'intrusion' to my private affairs with how many and of what type of 'guns' I own that are in my home. (powderburners or airguns). Luckily rest of Canada including NS are exempt of such law.
Hawk-i


Because the rest of the county, doesn't try to be it's own country inside a country.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 12:43 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 12:35 pm
Posts: 6066
Location: P.G. B.C.
Interesting about what info the QPP or Quebec Government obtained.
High River Alberta RCMP had the complete registration list for High River.
When one man went to pick up his stolen firearms from the RCMP, he was asked
"where did you get those two shotguns from, they aren't registered to you".
He replied - "I thought all records of registrations were destroyed. I bought them afterwards."

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Daryl


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 12:45 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 7:23 am
Posts: 2818
Location: Somewheres near the Atlantic
wheeliehd wrote:
HEY HEY! Nice and warm, sun shining here in the Banana belt. How is the weather out there? :lol:



Image


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 1:02 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2017 7:06 pm
Posts: 846
Location: Meaford, Ont.
Image

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 5:57 am 
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Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2014 10:49 am
Posts: 243
Location: QC
Hawk-I wrote:
Don't hesitate to call the Quebec office managing the Registration. If you have a valid PAL you have already gotten an email from them inviting you to register before January 29, 2019 and the phone number is in their message. Otherwise Google. You will get the right answer and unbiased information to your concern.
I have called them to get information on the 'types of firearm' that are not described on the Forms and they were very helpful. (en français évidemment).
I know it's a pain but it's not any worse than what it was when the Canadian Registry was in force and having to register our PAL rated airgun rifles.


You're right of course, I was just wondering if anyone had done so already.

Quote:
Listen, I don't like the idea either and I'm not attempting to minimize that 'intrusion' to my private affairs with how many and of what type of 'guns' I own that are in my home.


The list of justifications for this register are hard to argue against without sounding unreasonable, and framing it this way is obviously no accident:

Quote:
The Québec Firearms Registration File is very useful to police officers to assist them in their interventions and investigations. For example:

- When dealing with domestic violence, police officers are able to quickly determine whether firearms are likely to be present at the scene.
- When a person’s mental condition leads you to fear they may use it against themselves, it is preferable that he/she doesn’t have access to a firearm. Insofar as they know what firearms a person owns and where they are kept, police can intervene more effectively to prevent a suicide by removing them on a preventive basis.
- The information in the file facilitates police officers’ work when they are required to collect firearms from a person’s home as a result of a court-ordered firearms prohibition order against a person convicted of a violent crime or, as a preventive measure, when their state of mind presents a danger to themselves or others.
- When police officers respond to a barricaded person or a sniper, the information recorded in the Québec Firearms Registration File, concerning the nature and number of firearms likely to be present at the scene, may be useful in establishing a security perimeter and evacuating anyone who may be present.
- When a firearm is seized, found or otherwise recovered by police officers, its registration allows it to be traced and facilitates the detection of stolen firearms. The information in the file can then be the starting point for a police investigation.

It should also be noted that the registration of firearms also contributes to public safety by encouraging firearm owners to behave responsibly concerning firearms registered under their name.


These are legitimate benefits but as to whether they are justified vis a vis the intrusion on the part of the state is certainly up for debate and there is no doubt that knowing exactly how many firearms are in circulation and where they are located is prime information should confiscation ever be considered. That is a debate for elsewhere however, for the time being I'm mostly concerned that any tuning activities be above board.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 4:39 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 12:35 pm
Posts: 6066
Location: P.G. B.C.
PZAM wrote:
Trying to wrap my head around some specifics of the new legislation, the SIAF Website lists the following requirements to register a non-restricted firearm:

Quote:
the brand;
the model;
the length of the barrel (Watch the video capsule titled Measuring the length of a firearm);
the mechanism;
the type;
the calibre;
the serial number of the firearm;
if the firearm does not have a serial number, any other number affixed to or placed on the firearm for the purpose of identifying it, e.g. the number of the self-adhesive label provided by the federal government at the time of the Canadian Firearms Registry and still affixed to the firearm;
if the firearm has already been registered, its unique firearm number (UFAN);
the place where the firearm is kept.


If say a PAL owning individual was to manufacture a PAL rated air rifle from scratch, what would the registration procedure be? The FAQ section did not yield any answers.

What about a sub 500 fps air gun being tuned to fire at higher velocity, at what point should it be registered? What if it is then de-tuned?


Not sure what the Quebec Government will do with that.

As a sort-of similar situation, I purchased a 6" model 29, S&W .44 mag. registered as restricted, of course. After some shooting with it, I did not like the 6" bl. so shortened it to 4" & re-registered it as a 4" bl. Shortly after that, all 4" bl. handguns were re-classified as prohibited handguns, thus my .44 was deemed to be prohibited and was grandfathered so I am in possession of a 12/6 P.A.L. I inquired of the Feds (Canadian Firearms Centre), that if I re-barreled the handgun to a 5", 6" or 8 3/8", would the classification be changed. They said no, that serial # is now a prohibited firearm & will remain so.
So - perhaps there you have it. Once a firearm, always a firearm - unless deactivated by someone licensed by the fed. government. Seems that is or may be the only way to get a classification changed from worse to not so worse, or bad to good, however you think about it.
Or - perhaps it depends on who you talk to, or who is in the firearms branch at that time of the inquiry - maybe & how they feel that day?
I would simply call "THEM" and ask, after all, I am already on the "watch list" and checked/scanned every day of the year for violations that would render me a threat to pubic safety, as are all P.A.L. holders.

_________________
Best Wishes
Daryl


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