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PostPosted: Fri Dec 27, 2019 1:07 pm 
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Recently my Witness 1911 BB gun suddenly started leaking... Once you tightened up the co2 capsule, it leaks all out instantly from the top...

Checked my Google friend, ppl said you can fix it by cleaning the valve thoroughly and re lube the seal...

I did that today and found the valve and the inside or the valve tube are very dirty with lots of tiny black color parricles... Wiped all clean with a patch, and relubed it with pellgunoil and put things back in... It still leaks all out when I tightened a new co2 capsule in but looks a little little bit slower than before...

Then I looked at the things and found it looks some damage on the valve end seal body (pls see picture ) . Although I doubt that's not a wear and looks it's from the factory as that part is not moving at all after installed and should not be the problem...

And should I take out the o ring and replace it?? But it looks hard to take it out from the hole and out back in to the spot correctly... Can I just add another o ring on the valve seal guide to seal it again by using double o rings?!

Or I have to buy a new mag for my gun?!

Thanks a lot in advance for any inputs ~
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 27, 2019 2:15 pm 
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you need to make sure there are no metal filings at all on the delrin seal,
it can be very tiny you may need a magnify glass or jewelers eye glass to see them... :wink:


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 27, 2019 8:54 pm 
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Cleaned it again. And same result....

Is that any possible the spring is weaken as this gun is about two years old, although it's not being abused at all, but did go through 20, 30 co2s I think... If the air is leaking out from around the 'plug', not around the seal... Image

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2019 1:37 pm 
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YepYep,

If you believe the issue to be the seal around the valve 'plug', try some thin strips of 800 grid sandpaper and refinish the sloped area of the delrin seal. Run them in and out with just the pressure of the plug holding them against the seal. Then finish by running it in a circular fashion around the seal. You are then resurfacing the sloped part of the seal.
As Ace mentioned, get a good look in there first, you may have to carefully remove any debris in the valve face with a small pin before resurfacing (for example, right at the 1'oclock position of the valve face in your recent photo.

I have done it many times and now use a filter placed just above the puncture mechanism to capture all the debris. Similar to how this works in the Crosman pistols with part 38-028.

This won't help if the o-ring is the issue, however.

Or just replace:
https://www.replicaairguns.ca/kwc-1911-valve-set
https://www.replicaairguns.ca/kwc-1911-o-ring

Hope you can get it working.

Cheers!


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2019 2:01 pm 
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Thanks so much for the input!

I will try resurfacing the delrin seal first to see the result. And the KWC valve kit is a great stuff and it's in my cart now, I will buy one for sure just checking if anything else I can combine into the same purchase ~

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2019 2:45 pm 
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YepYep wrote:
Cleaned it again. And same result....

Is that any possible the spring is weaken as this gun is about two years old, although it's not being abused at all, but did go through 20, 30 co2s I think... If the air is leaking out from around the 'plug', not around the seal...
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lol..I thought i sent this yesterday now i see it didn't go through,
possibly in a rush forgot to hit send... :roll:
this is what i was talking about you can clearly see it in the pic, any small debris
or fine cuts in the delrin seal will cause a leak, air will find its way out


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2019 3:21 pm 
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Couldn't you place the delrin in the oven a bit, soften it up. So you can close the poppet/plug to have it re seal?

I thought I read something about Disco valve stems, and this method.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2019 7:27 pm 
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Can a hair dryer do the trick too? Will try this too~

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2019 7:59 pm 
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YepYep wrote:
Can a hair dryer do the trick too? Will try this too~

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I found this,

airmec wrote:
I remember seeing on a certain forum, a certain Alex suggested ''baking'' the valve (without the Orings) at 180-200 °F for 15-20 min to help the poppet seat... I never did it tough, so I can't tell if it works or not.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2019 9:10 pm 
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Wrapped with aluminum foil?! 8-)

Baking it right now and will report back... So do I still need to fine sand it later?

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2019 9:19 pm 
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I think in the process, after heating up, the poppet will 'seat' itself properly onto the seal.... Right?

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2019 9:49 pm 
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YepYep,

You may not need the sanding after the heat. I saw a video once (couldn't find it again) using a flame from a lighter to do it. The oven is probably more controlled heat, however. :lol:

As long as there is not debris caught in the seal face. Not sure heat will work then, unless it allows the debris to press in flush.

Let us know how it goes!

Cheers!


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2019 10:29 pm 
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Baked on about 180F for 15 minutes. Tested directly after cool down. Leaked as before. Maybe should try on higher temperature if ppl using flame from a lightet which would be much hotter...

And I think maybe I need to clean the penetrating needle and related areas as a lot of black particles was 'washed' out again after the co2 leaked out... But, how?! Looks impossible to reach those spots....

I only have 400 and 1000 grits sand paper right now. So I just sanded it with the 1000 grits, looks better surface after sanding... However it's hard to tell if still minor gaps between the plug and the seal...

Tested again after the slightly sanding... Failed... But looks after another cleaning and the last leaking, there looks no more particles 'washed out' again this time...

Looking for an extra o ring to add on the delrin seal to try the one last time...

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2019 10:41 pm 
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before you tried to heat the delrin you must make sure there is absolutely no particles
on the delrin, like i said you must use a high powered magnify glass or a jeweler eye peace
and when you heat it you must press the stem into the seal to make a new seat impression
so that any cuts or scratches are gone...if it doesn't work you need a new one

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2019 11:21 pm 
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Ace wrote:
before you tried to heat the delrin you must make sure there is absolutely no particles
on the delrin, like i said you must use a high powered magnify glass or a jeweler eye peace
and when you heat it you must press the stem into the seal to make a new seat impression
so that any cuts or scratches are gone...if it doesn't work you need a new one
Yep, cleaned before heating. I don't have the high power glasses, but I have the cellphone camera which I use on reading the fine prints always... So I believe it's cleaned well...

Then, maybe we need higher temperature?! When I took it out, it looks still hard and nothing like 'soft' to my touch... And I should press it hard to seat it? I didn't do that, just letting the spring inside the valve to pull the plug onto the seal...

And the delrin seal is moveable around the stem of the plug... How can I make sure they touch each other on the same spot every time?

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