CO2 Gun Selection Question

[birdman]

I started into airguns earlier this year with a couple of pump style guns (Crosman 760 and 1377) so my teenage girls and I could shoot in our unheated barn. Subsequently, as the cold continued, I took advantage of a TSC sale and added a Daisy 953. With warmer weather almost upon us I am beginning to think of expanding my collection to some type of CO2 gun. The question is which or what type!

I liked the look of the Crosman 357 but understand that it has been replaced by the Vigilante. I was wondering what the experiences were with the Vigilante and whether there were other pistols in the same general price range that perhaps I should consider.

I was looking for a pistol that would be able to shoot at a variety of targets (hanging spoons, cans, bottle caps...) in quick succession in an attempt to add a time component to our shooting.

What about on the rifle side of the equation? I do not recall having seen mention of many CO2 rifles in the discussions. Are there reasons for this or is it because people move from pump or springers to PCP rifles?

Any thoughts or comments would be helpful.

[Plinkercases]

for spoon hunting the Crosman 1077 now on sale (I think at least for a few days more) at TSC (if you are in Ontario) is on sale. Co2 repeater and lots of fun. I find it accurate enough not to be frustrating at all.

The Crosman long barrel revolvers I have a fun to shoot and also accurate enough not to frustrate. OK in DA and great in SA mode. not bad for smaller hands one they get used to proper grip. My nephews (10 and 7) loved shooting the 357's I have.

Just my experience and hope this helps.

[gctkaz]

I liked the look of the Crosman 357 but understand that it has been replaced by the Vigilante. I was wondering what the experiences were with the Vigilante and whether there were other pistols in the same general price range that perhaps I should consider.

As far as I know, both the 357(6-W) and Vigilante are in current production. IMO it's a great choice if you are looking for a good CO2 pellet shooter.

I have a Vigilante and am very pleased with it - paid about USD$50. At first I chose the Vigilante over the 357 since I thought I would make use of the rails, but the stock sights are very precise and if I were to do it again, I would choose the 357 for its better looks, though IMO the Vigilante isn't bad-looking. Mine pierces CO2 cleanly with barely any hiss of lost gas, and holds longer than I need it to. Usually I keep shooting until I run out of gas since it's too much fun.

One thing to note, the Vigilante comes with a 6-round BB magazine while the 357 does not. In my experience, the BBs do not stay in the magazine and two of them at either side will fall out when you make your first shot. I only used it to drain out the CO2 once it was too weak for wasting pellets, but now I don't even bother anymore and just empty the CO2 by dry firing.

It is a very accurate pellet shooter and I will once again mention that the sights are excellent. You can get extra pellet magazines, but if you have only one, a good thing to do is to remove one or both grips each time you reload, and just sit on the frame to warm it up while you fill up the magazine. You should PROVE the gun safe while you do this, of course!

If nobody else has mentioned yet, the Crosman 2240 is another great choice at a good price. IMO one of the best performance:price on the entire market, with the Beeman P17 being the other, but that's not CO2. I bought a 2240 for my father, who is using it stock except for a steel breech and red dot, and I think I will buy one for myself soon.

[birdman]

To start I had done a quick search on PyramidAir to get a feel of other CO2 pellet pistols and saw the likes of Gamo PT-85, Beretta PX-4, Daisy Powerline 008 and 617X, Smith & Wesson M&P 45, Walther PPQ / P99 Q among others. I tended to stay away from the BB only guns because of riccochets.

Seems that some shoot a little faster, some have bigger shot capacity, some weigh more. I guess it comes down to look. Since I have a 1377 you can guess looks aren't necessarily tops on my list, nor am I a history buff.

I had looked at the Beeman P17 and thought it might be a good future purchase (maybe for next winter ). I had also looked at the 2240 and liked that too, but was hoping for a pistol that was not single shot, for now.

I had not considered putting a scope on the pistol so the question of a rail is not a biggy for me.

[rav]

birdman wrote
To start I had done a quick search on PyramidAir

Are you living in the States or Canada?

and saw the likes of Gamo PT-85, Beretta PX-4, Daisy Powerline 008 and 617X, Smith & Wesson M&P 45, Walther PPQ / P99 Q among others.

From all these my personal choice is the Gamo PT-85. It has a nice blowback action and is built a notch better than the Beretta PX-4 Storm. Mine shoots slightly over 400fps with a 7gr pellet at 20C.
I also have the Daisy 008 and rarely shoot it if at all. Break barrel design, non-blowback and rather average build quality. Similarly, the Daisy 617X is a break barrel design, very plasticy, the piercing knob is exposed, very primitive. The Smith & Wesson M&P 45 and Walther PPQ / P99 Q are very plasticy and primitive.
I don’t know what’s your budget but you may consider moving into an upper shelf territory where you have a plenty of choices in the Umarex pistols such as the Beretta 92FS, Colt 1911A1, S&W 586/686, CP88 (Competition), CP 99 and the last but not least a big gun big fun the Desert Eagle blowback pellet pistol .177cal shooting around 450fps with the greatest accuracy possible. All of them have an impeccable quality.
If you are living in the States the Umarex pistols will cost a bit less than the same ones in Canada.

[AirGunEric]

I liked the look of the Crosman 357 but understand that it has been replaced by the Vigilante. I was wondering what the experiences were with the Vigilante and whether there were other pistols in the same general price range that perhaps I should consider.

The Vigilante is the same gun as the 357- just the additional rails and it coming with a 6-shot magazine to hold BB's, otherwise it is exactly the same gun- so anything applicable to the 357 is equally applicable to the Vigilante.

And the 3576W is not in production, the Vigilante replaced it outright.

[Sonic]

You can't go wrong with the 357! Inexpensive,accurate and simple.

[Plinkercases]

357 for sale now on this site

http://www.airgunforum.ca/forums/topic61272.html

[Reaper]

My opinion: Vigilante & 2240 w/. Steel breech
Shooting .177 & .22 JSB's

[birdman]

Rav, a Canuck, lol.

Thanks for the pistol recommendations.

I also see there is an older model http://www.airgunforum.ca/forums/topic61604.html

Other than the Crosman 1077 rifle recommendation, are there any other CO2 rifle users?

[robipaul]

X whatever on the 357, show me another hand gun that does what this one does at that price, not sure if i understood they stopped production or not, but it is still available either online or your local CT, this is the one to get, and you have to admit, its badass looking

my girlfriend has expressed desire to learn how to shoot, i put my entire collection on the kitchen table and asked her to choose one, she immediately went for the 357, i asked why that one, she said, because its just cool.....now i have to follow thru

[Plinkercases]

my other co2 rifle I love is an older Crosman 180.... if you can find one... it kicks and is accurate and is a smaller gun for young ones. but single shot and 22.

and while I don't have one... there was lots of chat a while ago here about the hammerli 850 which is co2...seemed to be a love hate split on the forum but you could search it and see for yourself.

http://www.pyramydair.com/s/m/Hammerli_ ... ifications

[AirGunEric]

For people who like the 357/Vigilante price-for-performance, you may not have noted this: http://scopesandammo.com/storefront/pro ... stol-p-976

[Edmonton<500]

On the rifle side, using your specifications, I'd recommend the QB 78D.
http://scopesandammo.com/storefront/pro ... ifle-p-417

It's powered by two 12-g CO2 carts, and it can easily be modified to shoot HPA at a later date. This gun shoots fairly well out of the box, but has tons of upgrades available for it.

On the pistol side, I would definitely stay away from the PX4, unless you have a lot of time to shoot, and considerable patience while you learn how to shoot that hard-blowback pistol. In fact, If accuracy is your thing, then I'd stay away from blowbacks, period, except perhaps for the Desert Eagle, which I find to be my most accurate blowback pellet pistol.

Action pistols are primarily BB shooters. I've heard both good and bad reviews for the Daisy Powerline 008 and 617. The latter offers single action for better accuracy, but many condemn the breakdown latch as being too flimsy, and the magazine holds only six shots. The 008 offers an 8-shot mag, but it has no single action mode to improve accuracy.

Smith & Wesson M&P 45 is very similar in workings to the Daisy 617. Umarex calls this DAO pistol, but you can use it in single action by pulling back the moveable slide. It has an 8-shot mag as well, and many say its a very accurate gun (I don't own one), but the fps is considerably lower than the Daisy models.

The Walther PPQ is another DAO gun, so that will have some influence on accuracy for most shooters. But this pistol's worse accuracy enemy is its unbearably long, stiff trigger pull. Try before you buy -- I sold mine after two days and a sprained finger. As with a blowback gun, this one will take some getting use to before you see its accuracy potential.

If it were me, I'd spend a little more money; have a good look at the Walther CP99, or if you're looking' to treat yourself, a Baretta FS92. All of these pistols, with the exception of the Daisys, are made by Umarex, and any higher-end Umarex pellet gun with the rotary mag, would be a good choice.

On the economy side, you just can't beat the old reliable 357. X5+

FWIW

$0.00

Edit: Sorry, it looks as if rav beat me to it on most points here.

[rav]

birdman wrote
Other than the Crosman 1077 rifle recommendation, are there any other CO2 rifles?

Now Edmonton<500 beat me to the QB78D(Deluxe). However, I agree 100% with his exquisite taste regarding the QB78D.
I’ve had the QB78 Deluxe for a few years and I'll never part with it. It is not only superbly executed but also very accurate up to 20m (20yards).
Eric at Scopes and Ammo also has a new Xisico XS-60C but I don’t know this one. Eric claims .25" grouping at 10m! Looks interesting.